Why abstain from meat?

No thanks, I prefer to eat meat like humans are meant to do

That argument is wrong and based on nothing lol

 

[Lean]

That argument is wrong and based on nothing lol

Prove me wrong then. Humans are meant to eat meat, which explains why we started to evolve rapidly after the discovery of fire

 

Prove me wrong then. Humans are meant to eat meat, which explains why we started to evolve rapidly after the discovery of fire

The ridiculous claims are being made by you, I've already provided empirical evidence that demonstrates that veganism is not only entirely viable but is also superior to an omnivorous diet (please see scholarly article linked above).

The burden of proof is thus on you. Prove to me that what you're saying is correct. It isn't.

 

[Lean]

The ridiculous claims are being made by you, I've already provided empirical evidence that demonstrates that veganism is not only entirely viable but is also superior to an omnivorous diet (please see scholarly article linked above).

The burden of proof is thus on you. Prove to me that what you're saying is correct. It isn't.

I'm not saying that vegetables aren't healthy, and that you can't live off of just them alone. What I am saying is that it is a proven fact that once humans discovered the use of fire and were able to increase the amount of meat that they ate they started to evolve at a more rapid speed. The explanation for this is pretty simple. Modern studies have shown that the human brain consumes about 20% of the body's energy during rest. Which is twice that of primates and other animals that live off a strictly raw food diet. Meat and cooked foods are needed in order to provide the necessary calorie boost that supports brain growth and development. You can look it up, it's a proven fact

 

I'm not saying that vegetables aren't healthy, and that you can't live off of just them alone. What I am saying is that it is a proven fact that once humans discovered the use of fire and were able to increase the amount of meat that they ate they started to evolve at a more rapid speed. The explanation for this is pretty simple. Modern studies have shown that the human brain consumes about 20% of the body's energy during rest. Which is twice that of primates and other animals that live off a strictly raw food diet. Meat and cooked foods are needed in order to provide the necessary calorie boost that supports brain growth and development. You can look it up, it's a proven fact

Again, the burden of proof is on you. You're making a claim. I have proved my claims already.

If we assume that you're correct (I'd still like you to provide proof), it's entirely irrelevant. Humans evolved to how we are today equally by use of primitive tools. Does that mean we should not have improved on our tools and invented modern technology? As I mentioned before, veganism is literally a dietary improvement. Eating meat is primitive. It is no longer required. You are perfectly capable of meeting a high caloric intake using plant-based meals and to function normally on such a diet. Nobody requires meat anymore.

 

[Lean]

Again, the burden of proof is on you. You're making a claim. I have proved my claims already.

If we assume that you're correct (I'd still like you to provide proof), it's entirely irrelevant. Humans evolved to how we are today equally by use of primitive tools. Does that mean we should not have improved on our tools and invented modern technology? As I mentioned before, veganism is literally a dietary improvement. Eating meat is primitive. It is no longer required. You are perfectly capable of meeting a high caloric intake using plant-based meals and to function normally on such a diet. Nobody requires meat anymore.

You can research it, it's a proven fact that what I say isn't purely claims

 

You can research it, it's a proven fact that what I say isn't purely claims

Do you know what burden of proof means?

 

[Lean]

Do you know what burden of proof means?

I took criminal justice, criminology, juvinille justice and criminal law in college. Is that actually a question? It's a proven fact, look it up

 

I took criminal justice, criminology, juvinille justice and criminal law in college. Is that actually a question? It's a proven fact, look it up

The fact that you keep telling me to "look it up" tells me you don't know what burden of proof means lol

 

[Lean]

That fact that you keep telling me to "look it up" tells me you don't know what burden of proof means lol

mkay, interesting

 

[Admires]

The fact that you keep telling me to "look it up" tells me you don't know what burden of proof means lol

There's nothing to argue. You're right in that we don't "need" meat, however, claiming that a vegetarian diet is better than a meat diet is nonsensical.

I read the peer-reviewed article you linked and the number of confounding factors I found in it were astounding. First off, they didn't take into account that vegetarians just have healthier diets overall. To be a vegetarian, you have to care about your health more than the average person. Therefore, a vegetarian may eat less junk food and drink more water. They didn't account for this in the study when they stated "vegetarians have fewer diseases overall".

If I ate a piece of grilled chicken breast along with my vegetables every day, compared to people who just eat vegetables (holding all other factors constant), I would be just as healthy (if not healthier due to me getting more protein) than the vegetarian. The study in the paper you cited didn't hold other possible confounding factors constant. They just compared a meta-analysis of vegetarians and compared them to omnivores.

 

[mrpker802]

I used to eat meat but then I made a conscious decision that it's not worth causing the pain to another sentient being for my own taste. I like being vegetarian and the food is good as well as the nutrition, you just have to have a good meal plan to get everything you need. Each and every person can make their own decision wether they want to eat animals or not, it's up to them. Health wise I don't really know if meat is unhealthy for you. For me it was just a conscious decision to stop eating it.

 

There's nothing to argue. You're right in that we don't "need" meat, however, claiming that a vegetarian diet is better than a meat diet is nonsensical.

I read the peer-reviewed article you linked and the number of confounding factors I found in it were astounding. First off, they didn't take into account that vegetarians just have healthier diets overall. To be a vegetarian, you have to care about your health more than the average person. Therefore, a vegetarian may eat less junk food and drink more water. They didn't account for this in the study when they stated "vegetarians have fewer diseases overall".

If I ate a piece of grilled chicken breast along with my vegetables every day, compared to people who just eat vegetables (holding all other factors constant), I would be just as healthy (if not healthier due to me getting more protein) than the vegetarian. The study in the paper you cited didn't hold other possible confounding factors constant. They just compared a meta-analysis of vegetarians and compared them to omnivores.

The comparison is justified. Are you assuming that someone who makes the choice in subscribing to a healthier lifestyle is automatically healthier than an omnivore? By reducing animal product intake, a lot of vegetarians and vegans are actually making themselves more susceptible to obesity due to the fact that almost all junk foods contain little to no animal products, while most other mainstream meals do contain animal products. Just because you choose an ethical lifestyle does not mean you are automatically healthier. Pretty sure you're alluding to a fallacy of nature here.

Just like most studies people base their arguments on. *sigh*

No one here actually knows. We all have our preference. I don't see evidence that not eating meat is worth it for me.

It's not about preference. For most omnivores it's about accessibility, not health or diet superiority.

 

Agreed! Includes myself. I haven't the time or funds to come up with replacements and haven't been convinced my dollar makes a real difference or that my health will improve, so it's more convenient to just not worry about it. 100%.

I could probably convince you it would be better for your health, but honestly since you're likely young those health benefits would be essentially negligible. Diets sans meat are absolutely beneficial to those susceptible to heart conditions though.

 

[Admires]

The comparison is justified. Are you assuming that someone who makes the choice in subscribing to a healthier lifestyle is automatically healthier than an omnivore? By reducing animal product intake, a lot of vegetarians and vegans are actually making themselves more susceptible to obesity due to the fact that almost all junk foods contain little to no animal products, while most other mainstream meals do contain animal products. Just because you choose an ethical lifestyle does not mean you are automatically healthier. Pretty sure you're alluding to a fallacy of nature here.

I'm basically alluding to the fact that people who choose to go vegetarian obviously care more about their diets because they go vegetarian for different reasons, one of which might be to become "healthier".

The average person who restricts his or her diet to something like non-meat products inherently cares more about what they put into their body than the average meat eater. The average meat eater is your average person who doesn't really mind what they put into their body, be it chips, cookies, or soda.

If you want a real analysis, you have to control for those other "weight-gaining" substances if you want to eliminate these confounding variables.

Hold all other variables constant and compare two people who eat the same things except one has grilled chicken in their diet every day. I'm positive the two would be as healthy (although I do believe the one who eats grilled chicken as part of their diet would be slightly healthier due to protein intake).

 

I'm basically alluding to the fact that people who choose to go vegetarian obviously care more about their diets because they go vegetarian for different reasons, one of which might be to become "healthier".

The average person who restricts his or her diet to something like non-meat products inherently cares more about what they put into their body than the average meat eater. The average meat eater is your average person who doesn't really mind what they put into their body, be it chips, cookies, or soda.

If you want a real analysis, you have to control for those other "weight-gaining" substances if you want to eliminate these confounding variables.

Hold all other variables constant and compare two people who eat the same things except one has grilled chicken in their diet every day. I'm positive the two would be as healthy (although I do believe the one who eats grilled chicken as part of their diet would be slightly healthier due to protein intake).

Exact same diets, though one is plus grilled chicken? Generally, you'd be right. When you're vegetarian or vegan you're not really eating the same as everyone else. As I discussed with Lean, you can't just remove meat from your omnivorous diet and call yourself a vegan/vegetarian. You need to accommodate for the nutrients your losing from meat intake. The argument isn't exactly relevant.

 

[Captain Mumps]

Generally vegans that do it for moral reasons are opposed to eating meat because they either

1) Think it's wrong to eat another living animal for food, usually with an appeal that all life is equal, which I disagree with.
2) Think it's wrong to take part in an industry that needlessly abuses animals just for profit. I agree with this one more, but it's less common.

I like meat because it tastes good. It's that simple to me, and it doesn't bug me that we kill animals for meat. We should treat them better, though.

 

[veichleproblem]

do you know how many times people are eating mcdonalds, steaks, chicken etc. like 3-4 times a week. There used to be a time when eating meat was a special occasion. People are carless

 

do you know how many times people are eating mcdonalds, steaks, chicken etc. like 3-4 times a week. There used to be a time when eating meat was a special occasion. People are carless

Careless of?

 

[veichleproblem]

Careless of?

no I said people are just careless