Homosexuality a choice?

[malakadang]

1. Are you saying perceiving ones environment is done unconsciously?

You cannot choose to be in a different environment. You cannot make the conscious choice to not perceive your environment. It's done whether you like it or not.

3. I don't have any evidence that I can layout for you. Nor am I going to go searching for it. But, thanks for "indirectly" causing me to raise my post count.

-As for this thread, I'm leaving it now. Thanks guys. It's been fun.[/QUOTE]Arbitrary belief eh?


I'll lay out some very simple logic for you:

We are trying to determine from 4 reasons why one can be homosexual:

Biological (Born that way).
Environmental (You become homosexual, much like one becomes an adult).
Conscious choice (You choose between two or more alternatives).
Experience (You had a homosexual experience, enjoyed it, and become homosexual).

Biological has been ruled out with the study I've cited for you, and you seem to be in concurrence.
Experience is unacceptable as people have been homosexual without any experience, and also, people have remained heterosexual even with homosexual experience.

This leaves two, a conscious choice, and environmental factors.

The logic for a conscious choice stands for other forms of sexuality. Thus means that heterosexuals too must make that conscious choice. There are many ways this can pan out:

If one has the ability to choose their sexual orientation, then a partial residual effects stands wherein they can re-select their sexual orientation. Clearly this is not the case. Perhaps it's a one off choice.

From this, we can conclude that certain portions of that conscious choice are unacceptable, but, it still ultimately could be a choice. However, conjectures are not allowed. We cannot rule this out, but in order for this to be true we must have some evidence supporting it. There is none.

So, we move on to environmental factors. Here, there is evidence to support. To save you from reading anymore, we must conclude that therefore homosexuality can be attributed to environmental factors, NOT a conscious choice.

 

[Noam]

You cannot choose to be in a different environment. You cannot make the conscious choice to not perceive your environment. It's done whether you like it or not.

3. I don't have any evidence that I can layout for you. Nor am I going to go searching for it. But, thanks for "indirectly" causing me to raise my post count.

-As for this thread, I'm leaving it now. Thanks guys. It's been fun.

Arbitrary belief eh?


I'll lay out some very simple logic for you:

We are trying to determine from 4 reasons why one can be homosexual:

Biological (Born that way).
Environmental (You become homosexual, much like one becomes an adult).
Conscious choice (You choose between two or more alternatives).
Experience (You had a homosexual experience, enjoyed it, and become homosexual).

Biological has been ruled out with the study I've cited for you, and you seem to be in concurrence.
Experience is unacceptable as people have been homosexual without any experience, and also, people have remained heterosexual even with homosexual experience.

This leaves two, a conscious choice, and environmental factors.

The logic for a conscious choice stands for other forms of sexuality. Thus means that heterosexuals too must make that conscious choice. There are many ways this can pan out:

If one has the ability to choose their sexual orientation, then a partial residual effects stands wherein they can re-select their sexual orientation. Clearly this is not the case. Perhaps it's a one off choice.

From this, we can conclude that certain portions of that conscious choice are unacceptable, but, it still ultimately could be a choice. However, conjectures are not allowed. We cannot rule this out, but in order for this to be true we must have some evidence supporting it. There is none.

So, we move on to environmental factors. Here, there is evidence to support. To save you from reading anymore, we must conclude that therefore homosexuality can be attributed to environmental factors, NOT a conscious choice.

Why do you say that homosexuality cannot be changed consciously? While I agree with your other points, I could decide to be gay or hetero whenever I wished. Mabye I wasn't getting what I was expecting out of hetero? Maybe I don't like being gay very much? It is a conscious decision, but is obviously also affected by environmental variables.

On another note, even the admission of being gay (EG. going out and telling your parents or something) needs a conscious acceptance of who you are.

 

[wptjah]

I think it's different for men and women. Women are more open with their sexuality which makes them more open minded about choosing a sexual partner whether it be for life, or a period of time. Whereas men have more of a natural desire to be with someone. What I'm saying is, for me, it wasn't a choice to be physically attracted to men, yet it's there. Trust me, if I could suppress those feelings, I would in a heart beat.

 

[Terrankiller]

I am not gay I couldn't tell you.

 

[acrylic]

I think a person is born that way, or something mentally happened to them.

 

[malakadang]

Why do you say that homosexuality cannot be changed consciously? While I agree with your other points, I could decide to be gay or hetero whenever I wished. Mabye I wasn't getting what I was expecting out of hetero? Maybe I don't like being gay very much? It is a conscious decision, but is obviously also affected by environmental variables.

I doubt that. Homosexual acts, sure, homosexuality itself, I doubt. I don't think I could suddenly make myself sexually attracted only to males, could you?

On another note, even the admission of being gay (EG. going out and telling your parents or something) needs a conscious acceptance of who you are.

Correct, but, there need not be a conscious decision. I don't think anyone made a rational decision about their sexuality. Did you ever have a sit-down with your parents discussing whether you'd be Homo, Bi, or Hetero? Perhaps you sat in a room one day and thought long and hard. Or, you just... are.

 

[Ivy Bridge]

Why do you say that homosexuality cannot be changed consciously? While I agree with your other points, I could decide to be gay or hetero whenever I wished. Mabye I wasn't getting what I was expecting out of hetero? Maybe I don't like being gay very much? It is a conscious decision, but is obviously also affected by environmental variables.

On another note, even the admission of being gay (EG. going out and telling your parents or something) needs a conscious acceptance of who you are.

That would make you bisexual, or a liar. I think I speak for the vast majority of straight people in saying that I (as a male) feel no attraction to masculinity or the male physique. Homosexuals are not the way they are because their first choice didn't work out.. they didn't have a choice. Whether it be they were born that way or environmental factors (which are out of their control for the most part, thereby rendering homosexuality not a choice) or even a combination of the two.

 

[So.Cal Life]

Forsome it is, for other's its not.
You can make the personal choice that women are scandalous, and arent that special in bed from guys.
Females can also decide the same in vice versa.

 

[Parox]

I think you should have also asked about bisexuals, there could be a connection.

 

[SteelSoapy]

People are born with genes. But, those genes put into certain environments decide what a person will be like. The genes themselves do not decide what the person will be like, although they do affect how the person will react to the environment they are born into or live in. So, theoretically, people might not be able to "choose", but it can be chosen for them. EXAMPLE: The stories of the boys with an abusive or lacking of a loving father (only a loving mother) turning out to be homosexual in a need for a positive male influence.

Of course there are stories like these that have to do with both heterosexual and homosexual beings, but there is a much stronger link between homosexuality and bad environments such as the one listed above. Meaning, that the boy's genes put into the home/family reacted in such a way making him homosexual over the time his body develops.

 

[Pockets]

I am not gay I couldn't tell you.

You could say whether or not your heterosexuality or asexuality or any other sexual orientation was a choice for you.