Do you support taxation?

Well fantastic, pay my taxes for me. I have lots of them.

I'm serious.

 

[Marine Clark]

Same here, bud. i support it for various reasons and i don't for various reasons, but in the end there still there.

 

[Smellex]

Who on earth would support it?

I'm sure 90% of people would hate paying tax. But at the end of the day, we have no voice/say in regards to having it or not.

 

Who on earth would support it?

Do you support the welfare state? public roads? public education?

Then you support taxation.

 

[Smellex]

Do you support the welfare state? public roads? public education?

Then you support taxation.

I don't.

The government does. I never voted for government either.

So I guess I don't have too.

 

I don't.

The government does. I never voted for government either.

So I guess I don't have too.

Well we're in agreement then. Now we just have to find someone who does support taxation, and we can have them pay our taxes right?

 

[Smellex]

Well we're in agreement then. Now we just have to find someone who does support taxation, and we can have them pay our taxes right?

Why do they have to pay for our tax? They'll obviously tell us to stop earning wages/money if we don't want to pay tax.

 

Why do they have to pay for our tax? They'll obviously tell us to stop earning wages/money if we don't want to pay tax.

Well because they support taxation, and we do not.

And what has earnings go to to do with it?

 

[Smellex]

What about GST then? What do you think of it,

Going off-topic but not gonna start a whole thread for that.

 

[cheater2010]

yeah i support it but i live in australia and last year only made 28k and thats the lowest tax bracket lol so i got back like $3600 lol and i aint paying your taxes you can pay mine lol

 

[Smellex]

We're both from Australia too. >,<

 

What about GST then? What do you think of it,

Going off-topic but not gonna start a whole thread for that.

Tax is theft. I don't support theft, therefore I don't support tax.

yeah i support it but i live in australia and last year only made 28k and thats the lowest tax bracket lol so i got back like $3600 lol and i aint paying your taxes you can pay mine lol

Great, so when can I send you my taxes? You will pay them right? To be consistent with your beliefs...

 

[FireZ]

yeah i support it but i live in australia and last year only made 28k and thats the lowest tax bracket lol so i got back like $3600 lol and i aint paying your taxes you can pay mine lol

So your volunteering to pay my FICA/State/Federal tax for me on each one of my paychecks? I only got "back" $1500 or so last year.

The government tries to act as if they are nice in giving me back what was mine already anyways.


For tax lovers, what on earth can taxes do that we as "citizens" cannot do ourselves?

 

For tax lovers, what on earth can taxes do that we as "citizens" cannot do ourselves?

Well that's not even the point here.

I would not force someone to pay for something they do not support, and I expect people to extend me the same courtesy.

I think we would all agree that ethical laws should be universal.

For example: it cannot be a valid moral rule that everyone except one guy is morally forbidden from raping. I.e. it cannot be an ethical law that raping is wrong, except in this one case for this one guy right here named Steve.

So, if it is wrong for me to force you to pay for a cause you don't believe in, (such as, for example: a project to arm every person in the middle east, or a project to setup a whaling base in the pacific ocean) then, logically, it is also wrong for you to force me to pay for your welfare state, wars, and ridiculous thugs in blue costumes.

Now if it is the case that this is a valid moral law (that no human should force another human to pay for a cause they don't believe in) then supporters of taxation should pay for all taxation -- especially my taxes, because I don't support taxation. And if it is not the case that this is a valid moral law, then it is not unethical for me to force you to pay my taxes. So either way, supporters of taxation should be paying my taxes.

 

[Danzzz]

Well that's not even the point here.

I would not force someone to pay for something they do not support, and I expect people to extend me the same courtesy.

I think we would all agree that ethical laws should be universal.

For example: it cannot be a valid moral rule that everyone except one guy is morally forbidden from raping. I.e. it cannot be an ethical law that raping is wrong, except in this one case for this one guy right here named Steve.

So, if it is wrong for me to force you to pay for a cause you don't believe in, (such as, for example: a project to arm every person in the middle east, or a project to setup a whaling base in the pacific ocean) then, logically, it is also wrong for you to force me to pay for your welfare state, wars, and ridiculous thugs in blue costumes.

Now if it is the case that this is a valid moral law (that no human should force another human to pay for a cause they don't believe in) then supporters of taxation should pay for all taxation -- especially my taxes, because I don't support taxation. And if it is not the case that this is a valid moral law, then it is not unethical for me to force you to pay my taxes. So either way, supporters of taxation should be paying my taxes.

Let's say the government said to you "okay, you don't support taxation, you don't have to pay." But other people continued to pay. You would still use the facilities that are made from taxation. If a friend had a heart attack you would still ring for a paramedic even though it's the taxes that you are not paying, that paid for that paramedic. You would still ring the police if someone broke in to your house. You would still use public roads. Taxation is crucial to being able to keep the general public in a "comfort zone" so to speak. Without taxation there would be anarchy.

 

Let's say the government said to you "okay, you don't support taxation, you don't have to pay." But other people continued to pay. You would still use the facilities that are made from taxation. If a friend had a heart attack you would still ring for a paramedic even though it's the taxes that you are not paying, that paid for that paramedic. You would still ring the police if someone broke in to your house. You would still use public roads. Taxation is crucial to being able to keep the general public in a "comfort zone" so to speak. Without taxation there would be anarchy.

It's not a valid argument so I'm not going to respond in detail, except to point out that: government has a legally enforced monopoly on most of those services. It also performs those services substandardly. Your question amounts to: if a gang of criminals moved into your suburb and took illegitimate ownership of the roads, and you disagreed with them, would you still use the roads?

The answer is of course yes, and you're an idiot for asking.

And now I'll ask you a question: how many lives must be lost before you stop supporting government force?

 

[Danzzz]

No. My point was that if you didn't pay taxation you would still be happy to use the services that other people have paid for. Without taxation there would not be public services or roads. You would be happy to take full advantage of services that you have contributed absolutely nothing towards. The government is not a "gang of criminals" they are a party elected by the general public. Explain to me how the world would be a better place if no one paid taxes and what you believe the end outcome would be.

 

No. My point was that if you didn't pay taxation you would still be happy to use the services that other people have paid for.

Yes.

And again, not an argument.

Taxation is theft. Theft is evil. Therefore taxation is evil.

^ you need to attack this.

Without taxation there would not be public services or roads. You would be happy to take full advantage of services that you have contributed absolutely nothing towards.

Correct. Because I don't support theft, nor using stolen money to build public infrastructure.

The government is not a "gang of criminals" they are a party elected by the general public.

I did not elect them. What you do with your time and money is your own business, but I did not elect them, therefore they have nothing to do with me.

Explain to me how the world would be a better place if no'one paid taxes and what you believe the end outcome would be.

Well for a start there wouldn't be any standing armies, and therefore very little warfare. Government was the number one cause of unnatural death in the 20th century. You also wouldn't have any government interference in markets, which means no great depression or global financial crisis.

In addition, you would have a free market in healthcare, which would be much cheaper, you would have a free market in education, which would have moved beyond blackboards I imagine. You wouldn't spend an hour getting to work; private roads are much more efficient. You wouldn't spend the first 18 years of your life as a second class citizen.

You would have 40% more income, to spend on cheaper goods. Private protection would be more affordable and avaliable than the court system. Insurance and banking would not be government run oligopolies, and therefore also affordable.

There's probably 100 more things I can think of if I cared to educate you on the matter.

But the question is: do you care? Do you care that taxation is theft. Incidently do you support taxation? And, can you prove to me that using violence to solve complex social problems (i.e government) works in the first place?

 

I'll post this pre-emptively, since I'm going for a walk.

Whatever you write, most likely not an argument. Burden of proof is not on me to prove that peace works. You support the initiation of force, you prove to me that the initiation of force (evil) will produce good. It never has in the past.

Also, can you send a cheque for my taxes, since you support them? (And I'm not kidding.) You can have the rest of your bs back. Thanks Danzzz.

 

[Travis]

what sort of tax rate do you get there?

I hate that i lose money to tax but love what it does for the country. People are going to moan either way. Cant really expect something for nothing.

You should get firez to pay your taxes =P he'll do it.