[APPROVED] Sythe vouch's correct counting

[S]

Why's this entire post based around the staff dealing with the issue? If it bothers people enough that they are saturating the amount of vouches users claim to have, they will report it. Clearly, you also did not read my entire post:

Bud, user A reports user B for having fake vouches. Now, whose job is to to validate the claims of the report?

Also, I used users who've been on this forum for a many years as an example.

Secondly, people having to 'prove' their vouches still have to gather said vouches, and then ultimately have them validated by a figure of authority - i.e. staff.

 

[gambling_babz]

Bud, user A reports user B for having fake vouches. Now, whose job is to to validate the claims of the report?

Also, I used users who've been on this forum for a many years as an example.

Secondly, people having to 'prove' their vouches still have to gather said vouches, and then ultimately have them validated by a figure of authority - i.e. staff.

I think you're missing my original points by using older members as an example, giving them lee-way over any other user. Let's say a user comes to this forum that originally has traded on PowerBot. If he has 300 feedback on PowerBot, does that gives him 300 vouches here? You would probably say no.

If a decade old user includes 500+ vouches that are "valid" from another forum, what difference does it make? In my eyes, none really. Both are abusing the Sythe Vouch forum by saturating their vouches through a different site.

 

[S]

I think you're missing my original points by using older members as an example, giving them lee-way over any other user. Let's say a user comes to this forum that originally has traded on PowerBot. If he has 300 feedback on PowerBot, does that gives him 300 vouches here? You would probably say no.

If a decade old user includes 500+ vouches that are "valid" from another forum, what difference does it make? In my eyes, none really. Both are abusing the Sythe Vouch forum by saturating their vouches through a different site.

Ok so, maybe I've miss-read this thread, maybe not.

I'm not talking about offsite vouches, or anything in the realm of offsite vouches. Solely talking about vouches on Sythe.

Edit: the OP's point seems to be about vouches on Sythe.org.

 

[gambling_babz]

Ok so, maybe I've miss-read this thread, maybe not.

Ah, nah. You didn't misread the original post, you just misread what I originally typed quoting @Lime . He mentioned
1) The loophole of users abusing the Sythe Vouch system (which I still stand behind). I think from now on out users should ONLY count vouches that are present in their vouch forum (to avoid the loophole. Nomsain?).
2) Lime mentioned how users are abusing the system in the titles of their posts by saturating their vouches due to using off-site ones. I don't think that should be allowed either, at least from here on out.

 

Couldn't be bothered to read this thread again,
but read it in the morning and seen someone say that it's wast of staff resources to count them,
there hardly any staff resource's used if they do it correctly,

Method A: User puts all the vouchs on the original post on there vouch thread,
Staff fo cthl + F , and type in said, counts vouchs automatically,
checks about 10 vouchs to make sure they're not the same useing same method,
bingo bango done, less then 5 mins of staff time,

method B user replies to a thread with every vouch,
staff just check number counter in top conor, and put vouch or 2 threw search bar of sythe. done and dusted.

Staff request user put the vouchs together them self, till they do it they got a dnt, if they incorrect, give them twc
simple done and dusted

 

[gambling_babz]

Couldn't be bothered to read this thread again,
but read it in the morning and see someone say that it's wast of staff resources to count them,
there hardly any staff resource's used if they do it correctly,

Method A: User puts all the vouchs on the original post on there vouch thread,
Staff fo cthl + F , and type in said, counts vouchs automatically,
checks about 10 vouchs to make sure they're not the same useing same method,
bingo bango done, less then 5 mins of staff time,

method B user replies to a thread with every vouch,
staff just check number counter in top conor, and put vouch or 2 threw search bar of sythe. done and dusted.

Staff request user put the vouchs together them self, till they do they got a dnt,
simple done and dusted

Literally this easy.
IMO it should be

User is underestimating by 25% they deserve a TWC.
User is overestimating by 25%+ they deserve a DNT.

I know it sounds technical, but it can be something this easy to avoid scumbags throwing a number in the air like it's nothing.

 

[Pain]

See now - This is easy for people like @Charlotte to support because I've never publicly seen her have to suffer the pain that what your suggesting would cause(At least, in public, she may of privately).

Right now my vouch thread has between 1700-2250 on it, but my vouch thread doesn't count hundreds of threads that have been up for years or that are years old - In reality my vouch count numbers (likely, estimate) between 3000-5000 strong.

Back years ago I had an incident of saying 1500+ vouches but I only had 100 on my vouch thread, as it turns out, I actually got reported and let me just stress this;

3 staff and I had to spend 12 hours(3 DAYS) going through the archives and pulling over 120-150 threads at the time(NO EXAGGERIATION)

The staff involved literally said they would never handle/do such a case again, that's how long it took and how many tens of thousands of threads the four of us went through together.

Your suggestion is that for every gold site ever that claims vouches to only use whats on their vouch thread - Do you know the scale in which your suggesting?

HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF THREADS would have to be combed through by staff everytime a report came up, the sheer volume of work is so staggering to think about just for myself let alone everyone else, Staff could literally still be looking through threads until fucking Christmas, this is such a waste of staff time for something that is such a minor issue(I doubt even 10 reports a year are made on this subject).

I shudder to even think about the amount of resources and time that would have to be dedicated to go through some of the older gold sites threads, some gold sites have hundreds of threads they've remade over the years hundreds of pages deep.

This would be a fucking NIGHTMARE, Beyond a nightmare.

I mean I literally shudder at the thought of someone like arcus or food4rs or someone who claims 10k+ vouches but only has 1,000 on their actual vouch thread, they literally have 100+ threads with probably 100 pages each, that's 10,000 pages to go through for 1 report!

This is so unfeasibly large that its almost borderline insane. Unless @Charlotte is volunteering to commit hundreds of hours going through a borderline insane level of pages to count vouches and keep track of them, I NEVER see the amount of time/resources required as being worthwhile ever. There's a reason this has never been done, its a unbelievable amount of waste of staff resources and time for something that might be an issue once a month.

NO, NO, NO SUPPORT.

Nobody has addressed the sheer volume of staff resources required for this.

p.s - There has not been a case of this since this suggestion came out to my knowledge lol.

This is a non-existent problem, I'd challenge someone to link a report of it since June lol.

I can think of only 2 cases with some fake vouches that have occurred and those aren't related.

 

[gambling_babz]

Nobody has addressed the sheer volume of staff resources required for this.

p.s - There has not been a case of this since this suggestion came out to my knowledge lol.

This is a non-existent problem, I'd challenge someone to link a report of it since June lol.

I can think of only 2 cases with some fake vouches that have occurred and those aren't related.

Because it's something that is commonly overlooked.

Want a perfect example of the Vouch sub-forum being used incorrectly?

Okay ... so how do we fix this?
THIS should come into effect - [DENIED] Lets start using the Vouch forum properly and stop the bumping loophole?
THIS should come into effect - Sythe vouch's correct counting

The bumping loophole is wrong, provides spam, and ruins the point of a vouch thread overall.

 

This is a non-existent problem, I'd challenge someone to link a report of it since June lol.

I can think of only 2 cases with some fake vouches that have occurred and those aren't related.

I've reported 8 people for it in past 2 months, all private.

 

[Pain]

I've reported 8 people for it in past 2 months, all private.

And how many of those resulted in bans.

 

And how many of those resulted in bans.

None, because of there being no rule about it,
Their market threads were locked till they counted there vouchs, and proved they counted them.
This suggestion is simple, to not allow people to say I have blah blah vouchs without proof of it, I don't get why you disagree with most common sense stuff

 

[Pain]

None, because of there being no rule about it,
Their market threads were locked till they counted there vouchs, and proved they counted them.
This suggestion is simple, to not allow people to say I have blah blah vouchs without proof of it, I don't get why you disagree with most common sense stuff

So you wasted staffs time 8x over for no reason and now you want to waste their time even more by actually making it a rule.

That's what I'm getting from this. You just wasted their time for no reason, no punishments were given out because the people u reported actually had those vouches.

Yet you think doing that MORE is a good idea?

Lol.

 

[gambling_babz]

So you wasted staffs time 8x over for no reason and now you want to waste their time even more by actually making it a rule.

That's what I'm getting from this. You just wasted their time for no reason, no punishments were given out because the people u reported actually had those vouches.

Yet you think doing that MORE is a good idea?

Lol.

So you think it's wasting time reporting people that have x amount of less vouches than they actually do? Are you serious, lol? Justifying yourself is one thing, but agreeing to exploitation is STUPID.

 

Couldn't be arsed to read all the comments but the OP totally makes sense and I'm not sure why this isn't a thing already plus it is way easier to keep track of your vouches and looks way more clearer that way. Yes of course it's nice to have more vouches but if they happened off-site, you should not be able to list/add them to your current Sythe vouches, that's just common sense really.

tldr: If you're not allowed to quote off-site vouches on your vouch thread yourself, you shouldn't be allowed to add off-site vouches to your total Sythe vouches.

 

Nobody has addressed the sheer volume of staff resources required for this.

p.s - There has not been a case of this since this suggestion came out to my knowledge lol.

This is a non-existent problem, I'd challenge someone to link a report of it since June lol.

I can think of only 2 cases with some fake vouches that have occurred and those aren't related.

So make the person do that work, whywould staff help? If you want to make a claim as to how many vouches you have, you should have proof that you have that many vouches. This is common sense.

If you don’t want to do the work, then don’t claim more vouches than you have proof of.

 

[Pain]

So make the person do that work, whywould staff help? If you want to make a claim as to how many vouches you have, you should have proof that you have that many vouches. This is common sense.

If you don’t want to do the work, then don’t claim more vouches than you have proof of.

If a report goes up, staff have to do the work because they can hardly ask the person being reported to count them for them, a staff(or many) would have to go through dozens/hundreds of threads depending whos being reported and spent hours upon hours, if not days counting those vouches to handle the report.

There's no way that a policy such as "U can only use vouches that are on your vouch thread" would ever apply, its been denied over, and over, and over. Its a free market and vouches on market threads are still valid reputation whether their on your market threads or vouch thread, their still YOUR vouches, to my knowledge its been that way for over a decade, which leaves staff to handle the heavy lifting when it comes to these reports.

There's no good solution, how it is now is the best way it will likely ever get.

 

If a report goes up, staff have to do the work because they can hardly ask the person being reported to count them for them, a staff(or many) would have to go through dozens/hundreds of threads depending whos being reported and spent hours upon hours, if not days counting those vouches to handle the report.

There's no way that a policy such as "U can only use vouches that are on your vouch thread" would ever apply, its been denied over, and over, and over. Its a free market and vouches on market threads are still valid reputation whether their on your market threads or vouch thread, their still YOUR vouches, to my knowledge its been that way for over a decade, which leaves staff to handle the heavy lifting when it comes to these reports.

There's no good solution, how it is now is the best way it will likely ever get.

I can guarantee you it will take a total of 2 minutes of their time. Maximum.

Report goes up and they see what’s being reported. They compare the advertised amount of vouches vs the recorded amount of vouches. If it doesn’t match, tag the offender to fix it. If they want to accumulate their vouches into one thread to properly count them, they can. If they feel that’s too much effort, make them advertise only the amount they can prove. This doesn’t waste staff time. It’s probably one of the quickest reports that could happen.

I don’t understand how you fail to realize this: advertising more vouches than recorded proof is false advertisement. This is the same as donating on a bunch of accounts, and posting a thread on one of them that says $1,000 donator when you only have $50 donated. You may have donated $50 on 20 different accounts, but it’s misleading and shouldn’t be allowed without the proper documentation to prove it.

 

Uhm, Not sure if this would even matter because on each thread, you can see the exact times you have been (replied) vouched. Most people quote their vouches on sales thread like "Pokole" to their vouch thread anyways.

The forum has this and only vouchers post on vouch threads anyways or the OP quoting and posting. This number would be true and a good way to count it.
I'm guessing that the point of this thread is that "you want mod's too count them" themselves. Highly doubt that staff would do this even if it's approved. If you were a staff? Would you waste time witchhunting people who has 100+ vouches or even more.

 

Uhm, Not sure if this would even matter because on each thread, you can see the exact times you have been (replied) vouched. Most people quote their vouches on sales thread like "Pokole" to their vouch thread anyways.

The forum has this and only vouchers post on vouch threads anyways or the OP quoting and posting. This number would be true and a good way to count it.
I'm guessing that the point of this thread is that "you want mod's too count them" themselves. Highly doubt that staff would do this even if it's approved. If you were a staff? Would you waste time witchhunting people who has 100+ vouches or even more.

Also you chrl + F type said if there on sythe thread, and give you full number Screenshot - c2cc6c6a9b98d313a4d14d60664b0111 - Gyazo

 

[Champ]

This suggestion has been closed, and will be addressed in the news announcement to come.