[Approved]Rule Reform v2

Discussion in 'Approved Suggestions' started by Pikachu, Oct 10, 2020.

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[Approved]Rule Reform v2
  1. Unread #1 - Oct 10, 2020 at 9:42 PM
  2. Pikachu
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    Original suggestion:
    [DENIED] Rule Reform

    The main example I am going to use throughout this is doxing but this also applies to hacking accounts and so on.

    This suggestion was originally was approved but over time it has changed

    Long story short I am requesting that black hat actives towards a banned/DNT member shouldn't be allowed.

    When I was staff we had discussion regarding this and whole team at time wasn't straight line, some thought it was fine to dox member who HAD debt and is all other cases no, some thought it was ok in general and some others thought it was 100% no, basically there wasn't much clarity on it at time and I am sure there has been more since.

    Whilst I have no issue with banned member being doxed, if they have debt, I don't think the doxing of any banned members should be allowed for allowed for reasons (This includes if they have debt):

    • Doxing is very unethical and beyond else just plain creepy.
    • Hacking is basically on same lines of scamming, but also unethical /
    • The chances of the wrong the information of person being share, so for example Doxing/Hacking the wrong person
    • Doxing/Hacking person and getting who are not involved involved (Example family members, no need to Hacking them for example)
    • The fact Doxing/Hacking is quite illegal in some countries
    • It makes the site look bad
    • The chance of member being afk for day or 2 then suddenly banned and blackhat actives being taken on them
    while I understand the argument of an user having debt, the chances of the wrong information being shared is high possibility and we shouldn't be letting user who are in shape form involved in Sythe to get doxed.

    We should try keep Sythe community as far as away as we possible can from these activities not encourage it

    I could go on more and more but I think best to let community bash it out.


    Edit:

    Two things I need to clear up:

    Doxing is not searching up someone information which I believe some people are getting mixed up with, doxing is sharing of one information.

    This suggestion applys for blackhat actives which alot of people are confusing
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2020
  3. Unread #2 - Oct 10, 2020 at 9:51 PM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    So is the suggestion to not allow doxing/hacking of banned members for any reason?

    While normally I'd agree if you have someone who owes you money you will want to get it back by any means necessary most of the time, I think sythe users being ALLOWED to do it is bad for the community and makes users less likely to pay-back/want to come back if they ever had any intention to from the start.

    So if you suggestion is to not allow doxing/hacking id support it.
     
  5. Unread #3 - Oct 10, 2020 at 9:52 PM
  6. Pikachu
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    Yes that's what I am suggesting, no doxing/blackhat of any current DNT user, banned user or regular users, basically to give banned user protection of any blackhat activities towards them
     
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    Last edited: Oct 10, 2020
  7. Unread #4 - Oct 11, 2020 at 5:39 AM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    No support, if people choose to not refund their scam victims they should be ready for consequences. I don't want sythe to become scammers safe haven
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2020
  9. Unread #5 - Oct 11, 2020 at 8:02 AM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    To be honest this forum already seems like it has a high amount of users who use it just to scam. I think Doxing and hacking is really shitty, but its a good deterrent for anyone who has been on this forum a while. (Has sent paypal to multiple users etc...).

    I also think that if the victim of the scam dox's the wrong person they should be punished as well though. (Id assume its setup like this already) So do it at your own risk.
     
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  11. Unread #6 - Oct 11, 2020 at 10:27 AM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    Here's how I personally look at it.

    Person A was scammed by person B

    I feel person A should be allowed to Dox the person who scammed them. As long as they use it to legally seek out reparations and do not share the information with other users.

    In my opinion, if you're not allowed to seek out someone who scammed you then you may as well bend over and grab your ankles as they can scam without any consequence and then create a new account becoming the perpetuating cycle it has now on all forums, black market and online marketplaces.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 11, 2020
  13. Unread #7 - Oct 11, 2020 at 10:57 AM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    I bet you could count on one finger the amount of times someone has been dox'ed on Sythe and the victim used the info to legally seek reparations, lmao. Dox'ing does no good for anyone.

    To your second point - What? This is why we have a feedback system....? There are consequences, outside of dox'ing, for people who scam. Similarly, there are often times consequences for buyers who do not properly vet their seller before making a purchase. Don't buy from people who joined the website yesterday. Those kinds of people don't have anything to lose when they scam. Have some common sense.

    Support for no dox'ing allowed. Black hat is black hat.
     
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  15. Unread #8 - Oct 11, 2020 at 2:04 PM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    I mean the consequences dont help the victims get any gp back though, unless the scammer wants to rejoin the community. Do you not think doxing is a good deterrent to prevent people from scamming?
     
  17. Unread #9 - Oct 11, 2020 at 2:18 PM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    Regarding the suggestion no support in fact I think someone who gets I support for the sake of their 'popularity' should make a suggestion allowing the doxing of scammers. The dox would make it more likely the person repays knowing people could tell people they know or get it back through them by other means. I don't follow Sythe much but I think what Wortel did releasing Giant Golaiths dox is the reason why he paid back so quick. I don't get why you guys want to protect serial scammers and hackers so much.
     
  19. Unread #10 - Oct 11, 2020 at 3:03 PM
  20. Zora
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    Pretty controversial topic. Personally I think doxing someone who is clearly (exit)scamming should be allowed. For example the StickTalk situation where he also got doxed and actually reported to the police.

    But like I said, it's controversial. If a user has an internet or power outbreak in the middle of a transaction, this could be a legitimate reason. Maybe require an X amount of time passed until doxing the user is allowed? Also, if a user got hacked and the hacker scams people, immediately doxing that user doesn't seem right imo.

    I think shitty people who steal from others do not deserve doxing protection from this website.


    I suggest that instead of not allowing doxing banned users (perm banned), do not allow doxing perm banned users on the Sythe platform. Don't discuss your stuff on this website or on the Discord etc. If a user is found doxing a perm banned user, it will not be punished. If a user is found doxing someone else, it will be punished. If a user discusses doxing on this website or in the Discord, it will be punished.
     
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  21. Unread #11 - Oct 11, 2020 at 3:07 PM
  22. Pikachu
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    I like the idea amount x amount of time, could save alot of issues, if this suggestion fails may be the best idea
     
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  23. Unread #12 - Oct 11, 2020 at 3:18 PM
  24. IGotOwned
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    Simmer down, chief. You suggesting that anyone who supports this wants to protect serial scammers is comical, illogical, and honestly slightly insulting.
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2020
  25. Unread #13 - Oct 11, 2020 at 7:31 PM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    My intention by releasing Giant Goliath's "dox" wasn't even to have him pay back, it was to make sure he can't hide behind his anonimity - but even then he would have a thousand million ways to scam once again, because this website (along with some others) rely on anonimity. Additionnally, the email I listed on his profile, aswell as his name, would help prevent such future scams. It's not really a "dox" either. Taking from Urban Dictionary a dox is "Personal information about people on the Internet, often including real name, known aliases, address, phone number, SSN, credit card number, etc.". Whatever I provided of him is merely his real name, girlfriends name (which I admit was weird) and email address - all legitimately obtained. The only wrong thing I did is post them without consent of the user who provided me them.

    I am however strongly against actual blackhat (such as obtaining information) through social engineering and such, or providing actual full doxes such as the one you'd find on Pastebin. By no means should this be allowed; banned member nor actual members. Sadly there's no distinction between banned and actual members anyways, considering most banned members are still active anyways.
     
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  27. Unread #14 - Oct 14, 2020 at 4:40 AM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    nah m8
    if they scamming they deserve the death setence
     
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  29. Unread #15 - Oct 14, 2020 at 9:06 AM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    if they fucked up and scammed no idea why sythe rules would protect them.

    no support from me
     
  31. Unread #16 - Oct 14, 2020 at 10:49 AM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    Scammers dont deserve protection from the very laws they break on Sythe.

    Ofc this should be more of case by case basis. Same reason admins have even said before that they wont entertain disputes nor cases by VERY severe rule breakers.

    OP if tmr someone doxxed Chris Kane would you object? Nah, bet you wont.
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2020
  33. Unread #17 - Oct 14, 2020 at 11:51 PM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    No support, I believe there should be repercussions if you decide to take someone's money, just because you're hiding behind a keyboard and computer doesn't mean you shouldn't suffer consequences. You steal something in real life, there is consequences, why should it be any different here?

    I also think the doxing should be only allowed for extreme cases, such as serial scams & big scam quits.

    As someone suggested earlier I think there should be a cooldown period just in case, but I can't think of any reasons to enforce rules to protect scum bags.
     
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  35. Unread #18 - Oct 15, 2020 at 7:11 PM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    Support. I agree with Pikachu.

    There's too many variables and too risky to allow this

    Just trade safely, use a MM, and don't trust people
     
  37. Unread #19 - Oct 17, 2020 at 3:28 AM
  38. spacegems
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    support. snitches get stitches.

    this is already a black market, if u don't wanna get scammed go join a regulated market. You accept the potential risks that come with trading in this market, but taking it outside of the market and inciting real world consequences defeats the whole purpose of the market and the anonymity factor. Allowing any amount of doxing is too much, it's probably a slippery slope until u start doxing people who got banned for plagiarizing ToS because they are your competitors. If something really bad happened then you can take legal actions through the proper governmental systems and let them work it out
     
  39. Unread #20 - Oct 17, 2020 at 1:23 PM
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    [Approved]Rule Reform v2

    Obviously support. Doxxing can put someone's life in danger because there are too many idiot man-children on the Internet who think its funny to swat people and have pizza sent to their house. Only look at the YouTube videos of Twitch streamers getting swatted to see how common and serious this is.

    Scamming is one thing but doxxing will not make it any better, if anything it would just provoke them even more.

    Sythe is not known as a blackhat / shady website, it is simply a (mainly) RuneScape marketplace along with some other games also, how about we keep it that way?
     
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