[DENIED]Clarify server owner liability

Suggestion basis: https://www.sythe.org/threads/4309427/resolved/

after reading this report and discussing it with multiple server owners, multiple concerns came to light.
these are best explained with a few examples:

1:

"Peter" buys himself a rank in gambling discord "Runedicingstakewager"
his rank costs 10b and gives him a 2B max bet.

"Peter" makes himself an alt account, "Retep" and "places" a 25B bet.
"Peter" "Scams" his alt, Retep.

according to the ruling, Server owner Runedicingstakewager is now liable for the 25B bet scam.


2:

"Peter" made himself a new account, he now joins "sythe services" as a worker.
he places a 100m deposit and gets to work.

RSfan007 decides to open a ticket, get's a service going.
he agrees to all terms of service, which clearly have a " please remove excess wealth" and a "workers have a 100m deposit" warning.
he is specifically informed about this in the ticket, before placing the order.

unfortunately, RSfan007 forgot to move his tbow off of his account before handing Peter the account details for the service.
Peter decides to grab the Tbow and go

"Sythe services" is liable according to the above report.


3:

"Peter" yet again decides to make a new account.
Now he joins "Sythe services" as a ticket support / moderator.
He places a 1000$ deposit in order to get the position, as well as providing some documentation.
In his agreement, in the server and everywhere is clearly visible that he is not authorized to perform trades beyond a 500$ value.

he now brings "Retep" again back into the new server, "buying" 100B 07 off of his alt.
This gold doesn't have to exist, it can be easily placed on a screenshot since "Peter" will just "loudly" disappear, "confirming" the scam

again "sythe services" is liable for the entire "100B" which doesn't even have to have existed in the first place.


Coming to the suggesting part of this thread:

Something needs to be put in place, that protects server owners from, in any shape or form.


1: gross customer negligence
2: severe bad intentions of staff members

Happy to hear other providers view and especially also the view of the staff team why the ruling was made as is, I can't imagine the above scenario's not being considered.

 

[Velos DMM]

Maybe make employee's sign a contract and a liability waiver with their real name etc. Collect ID / proof of adress etc , phone number etc. This would legally protect you and the business if they try and scam someone. This will also solve the problem of peter scamming hes alt account , because he himself will be legally bonded to the scammed transaction and not the company. See it as "workers work as "entrepreneur"

Many businesses actually hire external entrepreneurs to avoid legal liability incase something goes wrong.
Maybe the time has come were theres no other way but the offical way like how they do it in real life

 

[Bert]

#1 - Gambling clans are insured up to their max bet/pot, always has been ruled that way on Sythe, so no Runedicingstakewager is indeed not responsible for the 25b.

#2 - Excess wealth on an account stolen can't be proven who actually stole the wealth on the account according to Sythe previous reports

#3 - Where are the screenshots/proof of the 100b trade? Did you personally ask the customer if they agree to the terms of service and they specifically confirm that they agree (In writing)? ...Why are we getting all these stupid ideas while the simple way out is, don't hire workers you can't trust, if you have trust problems just like myself never hire workers no matter the deposit

 

#1 - Gambling clans are insured up to their max bet/pot, always has been ruled that way on Sythe, so no Runedicingstakewager is indeed not responsible for the 25b.

If it's applied to a gambling host, why is it not applied to a ticket support?
Or any staff for that matter.

I do not see a difference
It's an employee with a down payment as insurance, which can be considered bought trustworthiness.

 

[Bert]

#1 - Gambling clans are insured up to their max bet/pot, always has been ruled that way on Sythe, so no Runedicingstakewager is indeed not responsible for the 25b.

If it's applied to a gambling host, why is it not applied to a ticket support?

Why is a worker taking payments for a service? For gambling a customer bets directly with the host.

 

Are @EldoradoGG and @PlayerAuctions liable for a random scam on their platform in that case?

They take the payments, work is completed by a 3rd party (worker) on their website.

 

[Bert]

Are @EldoradoGG and @PlayerAuctions liable for a random scam on their platform in that case?

They take the payments, work is completed by a 3rd party (worker) on their website.

Is Sythe responsible if your worker scams?

 

Is Sythe responsible if your worker scams?

Does sythe middleman the transaction?

 

[Bert]

Does sythe middleman the transaction?

Is Sythe an open market? Yes.
Is Eldorado an open market? Yes.
Is Playerauctions an open market? Yes.

 

2 - Excess wealth on an account stolen can't be proven who actually stole the wealth on the account according to Sythe previous reports

https://www.sythe.org/threads/primalrs-6-85b-240-44usd-ltc-stolen-on-service/#post-72643814

I suppose not always, there are cases where "it can't be proven" and the providers still pay.

 

Is Eldorado an open market? Yes.

They are not.
They only allow verified sellers on their platform.

The payments go to them, and do not get released before the order is considered completed, they also take a commission.

Where's that different from a service provider?

 

[Bert]

https://www.sythe.org/threads/primalrs-6-85b-240-44usd-ltc-stolen-on-service/#post-72643814

I suppose not always, there are cases where "it can't be proven" and the providers still pay.

Hire better workers

 

At the end of the day, it's about time service providers realize the issue with hiring workers fresh out of venezulea to work on customers accounts, i can understand why it sounds dumb for the owners of the discords to be liable for what they scam regardless of the deposit amount, but due to the possibility of said worker being the actual discord owners themselves using their ' deposits ' as a loophole to scam x amount and only be liable for y the case stands. Hire workers you ACTUALLY trust, and do a good job at explaining to the customers that they are only meant to trust/leave x amount on accounts.

 

[Okamikun]

Why is a worker taking payments for a service? For gambling a customer bets directly with the host.

What stops a worker from taking payment?? Because they are told not 2 clearly not the case with the report this revolves around. Are server owners expected to shut the server down when they are asleep? Just because something is not suppose to happen when it does we are liable?

 

[Bert]

What stops a worker from taking payment?? Because they are told not 2 clearly not the case with the report this revolves around. Are server owners expected to shut the server down when they are asleep? Just because something is not suppose to happen when it does we are liable?

Im not an expert in service discords, but aren't "workers" added to the ticket after the payment is taken for the service?

 

[Okamikun]

At the end of the day, it's about time service providers realize the issue with hiring workers fresh out of venezulea to work on customers accounts, i can understand why it sounds dumb for the owners of the discords to be liable for what they scam regardless of the deposit amount, but due to the possibility of said worker being the actual discord owners themselves using their ' deposits ' as a loophole to scam x amount and only be liable for y the case stands. Hire workers you ACTUALLY trust, and do a good job at explaining to the customers that they are only meant to trust/leave x amount on accounts.

You mean like this?
Screenshot - 232232bbabc74f21a42aa320c6fd2c19 - Gyazo
Because that didn't work.

 

[Okamikun]

Im not an expert in service discords, but aren't "workers" added to the ticket after the payment is taken for the service?

Not in all cases and managers have access at all times
are we only suppose to hire family friends? Because non vennys scam 2. Just look are ace services I'd just like some server protection. I'd how big we have to make the announcement in each ticket I'd love the option.

 

You mean like this?
Screenshot - 232232bbabc74f21a42aa320c6fd2c19 - Gyazo
Because that didn't work.

All this screenshot shows is that they only deposited a certain amount.

 

Not in all cases and managers have access at all times
are we only suppose to hire family friends? Because non vennys scam 2. Just look are ace services I'd just like some server protection. I'd how big we have to make the announcement in each ticket I'd love the option.

Maybe do the work yourself instead, it seems a lot of the reason service discords hire ' workers ' are so they can make a lot of extra commission, if your willing to take that risk, you need to account for occasional scams and aim for a commission amount that exceeds that. IF you want to keep hiring dodgy workers that is.

 

[Okamikun]

All this screenshot shows is that they only deposited a certain amount.

It clearly states of the trade is over that amount the costumer is required to notify peanut or do multiple trades.