God does not exist.

overview on his wager.
1. atheists/others are right=good for then but their is no reward as non existance is met. But if wrong a eternity in hell is the reward.
2. believing in christianity= may not have done things you wanted in life but if ur wrong it wont matter as non-existance is met. But if were right eternal salvation is met as well as not being sentenced to hell for eternity.

This is just the agnostic's fallacy, again. It's an appeal to fear.

Aside it's being a fallacy, I've already defeated the body of the argument earlier in the thread. Go back and read.

 

[shawnvd]

At least you're not theist.

The thing about that, however, is there is more reason to deny God than there is to accept Him. Think about a teeter totter, on one end is a fat kid (atheist), on the other is a skinny kid(theist), and in the middle is everyone else.

There is more reason to not believe in an invisible teapot that revolves around the moon than there is to believe it. So are you simply going to say 'Until there is 100% evidence to show that there is not one, I will not decide.'?

Definition of Agnostic: One who believes that it is impossible to know whether there is a God.

Yes, I am pretty sure that there is no god, but there has yet to be any evidence to disprove that the universe was created by a god. If there is a god, he doesn't give a shit about us, so I don't really care whether god exists or not.

 

[BrianTirae]

You never mentioned.....

What do you classify as a god?

US president? with all that power he could be one.

Russian Army Head general? 100 Mass destruction nukes ready to blow?

Someone who can fly and blow the world up with a snap of his finger if he has one?

 

[blindkilla]

You never mentioned.....

What do you classify as a god?

US president? with all that power he could be one.

Russian Army Head general? 100 Mass destruction nukes ready to blow?

Someone who can fly and blow the world up with a snap of his finger if he has one?

It's assumed that the type of god being debated is a supernatural deity.

 

[Deacon Frost]

1. atheists/others are right=good for then but their is no reward as non existance is met. But if wrong a eternity in hell is the reward.
2. believing in christianity= may not have done things you wanted in life but if ur wrong it wont matter as non-existance is met. But if were right eternal salvation is met as well as not being sentenced to hell for eternity.

Just because YOU don't value life doesn't mean WE don't. It's not the fact that we will soon not exist, it's about having fun, and enjoying ourselves until that time. And knowing that when we die, we will have made a positive impact on others.

If we spend our lives 'believing in Christianity' not only are we committing ourselves to several countless atrocities in 'the name of god', but we'd also be wasting our lives accepting something that doesn't matter. And how can you say Christianity is the one true belief? What if believing in Christianity is a sin against another religion, and I just sold myself to the devil?

I'm gonna swing the debate, as you brought up 'hell', and say this...

Can you prove that right and wrong exist? What determines wrong? The bible? Is the bible right? Did God himself write the bible? How can you give credit to a book that was written by several men and is largely based off of previous religions and stories? Since the bible was written by men, we can assume their opinions of right and wrong are based off of their thoughts of what right and wrong might be.

SOOOO.... if this God character really is supernatural, then wouldn't he operate outside of the realm of morals and ethics? Wouldn't everything he did be logical. You can't create logic if you're not logical.

The whole story is bullshit, just accept that. Heaven and Hell are meant to control you with fear and promise of reward for good deeds.


shawnvd;

Accepting that there is not a God as there is no proof is Atheism. Neither accepting nor denying a God as there is no proof is Agnosticism. Accepting a God is Theism.

Most people are attempting to call themselves agnostics as they don't understand. If they come to a conclusion that God probably doesn't exist, they are atheists. If they can't make up their mind one way or the other, THEN they're agnostics.

 

[sup3r n00b]

You die and nothing happens. Congradulations Athiests.
You lived a nice, meaningful life indeed.
As a group, 99% of athiests are the most ignorant people in the world.
Just because there is no proof to show you jump on Christians trying to ruin their beliefs. It is rather sad i think.
If you need proof for everything in life then you really need to settle down.
Also, to Sythe, don't call Christians morons or idiots. It really makes you look un-intelligent. I mean you try to make a valid point, but then just let you're anger overcome your words.
I'm really not very active on Sythe the website itself, but this thread really caught my eye.
My bestfriend that i've known for 3 years used to be an athiest. He always asked for proof of God just like you all do. I really didn't bring it up to much because it caused tension between us. Finally, one Sunday i told him to come to church with me and see what he thought for himself. That day changed his life. He ended up getting saved and accepting Jesus Christ into his heart. He told me later that night, even if there isn't proof on paper that God exists, he just knew it in his heart the moment it all came to him.
Its unfortunate that you haven't had any encounters with God, but maybe a previous childhood is the answer to that.
Life isn't all about science. I'm a major in Biology and i love the subject itself, but i can still keep my faith because i know in my heart, that God is with me everyday.
I am so blessed, not by science, but by God that i have a house, food on the table, and a family. I'm not going to give the credit of that to Science, but to God.
If you are going to take apart what i'm writing it and critisize it, go ahead.
I really won't even be checking back on this thread most likely, i just wanted to express how i feel.

I'm not hating on any of you athiests, i'm just trying to tell my side of the story.

If you could, please approach this with some sense of maturity. Ok?

Thanks

-V

 

[lalmvpkobe]

Just because YOU don't value life doesn't mean WE don't. It's not the fact that we will soon not exist, it's about having fun, and enjoying ourselves until that time. And knowing that when we die, we will have made a positive impact on others.

If we spend our lives 'believing in Christianity' not only are we committing ourselves to several countless atrocities in 'the name of god', but we'd also be wasting our lives accepting something that doesn't matter. And how can you say Christianity is the one true belief? What if believing in Christianity is a sin against another religion, and I just sold myself to the devil?

you keep saying that you value life. Can you tell me what it is in life that you value?Knowing when you die lol? Ill say it again life is just a memory (think about that). You fail to realize the gravity of non existance as you can not comprehned it whatsoever. Non existance is the only thing in this life that actuallly scares me I can barely wrap my mind around me not being here. Me not thinking. Their being no me at all. And if that does not scare you then you are a fool.


edit-

You die and nothing happens. Congradulations Athiests.
You lived a nice, meaningful life indeed.

this ^^^

 

[Deacon Frost]

You die and nothing happens. Congradulations Athiests.
You lived a nice, meaningful life indeed.
As a group, 99% of athiests are the most ignorant people in the world.

Ignorant:
# uneducated in general; lacking knowledge or sophistication; "an ignorant man"; "nescient of contemporary literature"; "an unlearned group ...

In this case, you would be wrong. Atheists aren't ignorant at all. We're just closed minded, for the most part. Think about the fact that in the name of your Christian God, you've killed hundreds of thousands of people for not believing in him.

So don't try and call us ignorant, when you lot are the ones who have destroyed families.

Just because there is no proof to show you jump on Christians trying to ruin their beliefs. It is rather sad i think.
If you need proof for everything in life then you really need to settle down.

I don't try and ruin there beliefs because there's no proof. I try and ruin their beliefs as these folk are ruining our race, destroying our future, controlling our children, and causing mayhem everywhere they go. I could careless what THEIR beliefs are, I just hate that they impose their beliefs on others. Call it fighting back .

What's wrong with needing proof for everything in life? Acting on random fanatical belief systems seems like hardly the way to live. I'd rather rationalize than merely accept something as true because someone told me.

Also, to Sythe, don't call Christians morons or idiots. It really makes you look un-intelligent. I mean you try to make a valid point, but then just let you're anger overcome your words.
I'm really not very active on Sythe the website itself, but this thread really caught my eye.

It doesn't make him seem unintelligent. It's part of his argument, and it's a true point as well. Christians ARE morons and idiots by definition. He's not stating an opinion, it's a fact.

My bestfriend that i've known for 3 years used to be an athiest. He always asked for proof of God just like you all do. I really didn't bring it up to much because it caused tension between us. Finally, one Sunday i told him to come to church with me and see what he thought for himself. That day changed his life. He ended up getting saved and accepting Jesus Christ into his heart. He told me later that night, even if there isn't proof on paper that God exists, he just knew it in his heart the moment it all came to him.
Its unfortunate that you haven't had any encounters with God, but maybe a previous childhood is the answer to that.

Then he wasn't an atheist. If you've never heard of the God Spot, it's a part of the brain where intense emotion, and a sense of floating comes from. When people accept God, or believe in God, this part of their brain is incredibly active. The kicker is, it's in the imagination part of the brain .

Your 'atheist' friend clearly didn't understand atheism before he went to your church. If he was educated, then he wouldn't have accepted your beliefs. As simply as that.

Life isn't all about science. I'm a major in Biology and i love the subject itself, but i can still keep my faith because i know in my heart, that God is with me everyday.

I'll call that blind faith... Well all faith is blind. I could show you 100% proof that God doesn't exist, and you'd not accept it. No religious person was. It's because they can't open themselves up to reality, and are lost in a fictitious belief system.

I am so blessed, not by science, but by God that i have a house, food on the table, and a family. I'm not going to give the credit of that to Science, but to God.

You have money, you can buy food, a home, a table. You could be a foster child in a foster home... that would be a family as well. Farmers get food, construction workers build homes, lumberjacks get the wood for tables, and child protective services put children in loving homes everyday.

Don't discredit these peoples' hard work by giving all the credit to some random thought in your head. It isn't JUST science, it's people, it's reality.

If you are going to take apart what i'm writing it and critisize it, go ahead.
I really won't even be checking back on this thread most likely, i just wanted to express how i feel.

Just did. I couldn't let you get away with trying to persuade others to be idiots as well.

I'm not hating on any of you athiests, i'm just trying to tell my side of the story.

If you could, please approach this with some sense of maturity. Ok?

Thanks
-V

K, done.


EDIT:

you keep saying that you value life. Can you tell me what it is in life that you value?Knowing when you die lol? Ill say it again life is just a memory (think about that). You fail to realize the gravity of non existance as you can not comprehned it whatsoever. Non existance is the only thing in this life that actuallly scares me I can barely wrap my mind around me not being here. Me not thinking. Their being no me at all. And if that does not scare you then you are a fool.

It's not the end that matters. Aren't you supposed to be banned from this forum? You're just a troll who clearly doesn't understand.

The only reason you can't accept non-existence is because your brain won't let you. It exists, therefore it believes that it will always exist. It's not your fault you haven't developed the ability to think past your own self.

What do I value in my life? I value my family, the things I do, the time I spend learning, the enjoyment I get out of life. Why play a video game if there's not an infinite number of sequels? Because it's fun, and you enjoy it.

 

You die and nothing happens. Congradulations Athiests.
You lived a nice, meaningful life indeed.
As a group, 99% of athiests are the most ignorant people in the world.
Just because there is no proof to show you jump on Christians trying to ruin their beliefs. It is rather sad i think.
If you need proof for everything in life then you really need to settle down.
Also, to Sythe, don't call Christians morons or idiots. It really makes you look un-intelligent. I mean you try to make a valid point, but then just let you're anger overcome your words.
I'm really not very active on Sythe the website itself, but this thread really caught my eye.
My bestfriend that i've known for 3 years used to be an athiest. He always asked for proof of God just like you all do. I really didn't bring it up to much because it caused tension between us. Finally, one Sunday i told him to come to church with me and see what he thought for himself. That day changed his life. He ended up getting saved and accepting Jesus Christ into his heart. He told me later that night, even if there isn't proof on paper that God exists, he just knew it in his heart the moment it all came to him.
Its unfortunate that you haven't had any encounters with God, but maybe a previous childhood is the answer to that.
Life isn't all about science. I'm a major in Biology and i love the subject itself, but i can still keep my faith because i know in my heart, that God is with me everyday.
I am so blessed, not by science, but by God that i have a house, food on the table, and a family. I'm not going to give the credit of that to Science, but to God.
If you are going to take apart what i'm writing it and critisize it, go ahead.
I really won't even be checking back on this thread most likely, i just wanted to express how i feel.

I'm not hating on any of you athiests, i'm just trying to tell my side of the story.

If you could, please approach this with some sense of maturity. Ok?

Thanks

-V

No relevance to the claim 'god exists'; remember we're not accepting anecdotal evidence. If you claim god exists, and he's got all these fantastic powers, then you should be able to provide some direct evidence. No evidence, no valid claim.

K, done.

Deacon, you're working too hard in refuting really bad fallacious arguments. It usually suffices to point out that:
a) the argument isn't relevant to the claim, and
b) they are yet to provide any evidence to substantiate the claim, and
c) the argument is a fallacy (if it is one.)

Let them do all the hard work, after-all it's their bat-shit crazy belief, and the burden of proof rests squarely with them.

 

[sup3r n00b]

No relevance to the claim 'god exists'; remember we're not accepting anecdotal evidence. If you claim god exists, and he's got all these fantastic powers, then you should be able to provide some direct evidence. No evidence, no valid claim.

Take notice to the word THEORY (Ex Big Bang THEORY)in everything you seem to fall back upon?
Some proof you have right there?
You can't prove it, and never will be able to.
How are we some type of lifeforms with traits such as for example EMOTION.
Science could never prove Love, sadness, ect.
And to the guy that took about my writing, congradulations.
Call me an idiot and say this thread is somewhat of a debate?
Why can't you be a little bit more rational and try to just give me the facts and not your dumb opinion on my beliefs.
K?

Feel free to gang up on me. I find it quite hilarious.
One athiest finds another. Sees a Christian. Oh, then the rest is inevitable.
You guys need to stop being little kids agreeing with each other and trying to be funny at the same time.

 

[Bring Me The Horizon]

Here's my opinion. In the end, you won't find out until you die the REAL truth; so what's the point in debating over whether he's real or not. There's no REAL evidence that can be seen by the human eye. It's about believing in what you cannot see and nothing more.

 

[Deacon Frost]

Deacon, you're working too hard in refuting really bad fallacious arguments. It usually suffices to point out that:
a) the argument isn't relevant to the claim, and
b) they are yet to provide any evidence to substantiate the claim, and
c) the argument is a fallacy (if it is one.)

Let them do all the hard work, after-all it's their bat-shit crazy belief, and the burden of proof rests squarely with them.

I try, but I feel really bad if I don't pick apart everything they say. What if some little kid comes onto the forums and reads their post and 'finds enlightenment'. I could never forgive myself for not protecting that kid .

Take notice to the word THEORY (Ex Big Bang THEORY)in everything you seem to fall back upon?
Some proof you have right there?
You can't prove it, and never will be able to.
How are we some type of lifeforms with traits such as for example EMOTION.
Science could never prove Love, sadness, ect.
And to the guy that took about my writing, congradulations.
Call me an idiot and say this thread is somewhat of a debate?
Why can't you be a little bit more rational and try to just give me the facts and not your dumb opinion on my beliefs.
K?

/exhales.

Where did anyone mention the big bang? Is that the only thing you've got?

And yes, science has already proved love, sadness, and such. It's called a brain and chemicals.

I didn't call you an idiot, I defined you as an idiot.



Sorry Sythe, I tried D:!

Feel free to gang up on me. I find it quite hilarious.
One athiest finds another. Sees a Christian. Oh, then the rest is inevitable.
You guys need to stop being little kids agreeing with each other and trying to be funny at the same time.

Need I mention the Crusades?

Richard Dawkins forbid more than 2 Christians aggregate.

 

[lalmvpkobe]

I dont understand deacons logic about enjoying his life am i crazy sythe? do you share his oppionions on valuing life despite it being pointless if their is nothing after death?

you are failing to make me understand you deacon for example you cant think at all let alone value what you did in life after death so therefore i am confused at the purpose of living without an afterlife.


OMG I JUST THOUGHT OF A GOOD POINT-show me proof/evidence you value your family? show me proof you enjoyed that vidogame or you were happy you graduated show me proof that you were ever sad...etc....
-gf

 

Take notice to the word THEORY (Ex Big Bang THEORY)in everything you seem to fall back upon?

I don't fall back upon theories. And this has no relevance to your claim either.

Science could never prove Love, sadness, ect.

Already done. Documented, experimentally verifiable evidence exists. The pleasure centers of the brain have been studied extensively for years. Tens of thousands of pages of journal articles and data, experiments, and so on exist.

Why can't you be a little bit more rational and try to just give me the facts and not your dumb opinion on my beliefs.
K?

The facts are: you have yet to provide evidence to support your claim that 'god exists,' and everything you HAVE provided so far has been irrelevant to this claim.

 

[Deacon Frost]

I dont understand deacons logic about enjoying his life am i crazy sythe? do you share his oppionions on valuing life despite it being pointless if their is nothing after death?

Why does there have to be something after death for it to be meaningful?

you are failing to make me understand you deacon for example you cant think at all let alone value what you did in life after death so therefore i am confused at the purpose of living without an afterlife.

It's not my failure, it's yours.

OMG I JUST THOUGHT OF A GOOD POINT-show me proof/evidence you value your family? show me proof you enjoyed that vidogame or you were happy you graduated show me proof that you were ever sad...etc....
-gf

The proof that I don't hurt them, I talk to them frequently, I visit them when I can, I hug them, and I wish they wouldn't go away for a long while is proof.

As for the enjoyment, sadness, and etc, those have been proven to exist, my claiming I've had them is rational.

 

[sup3r n00b]

I don't fall back upon theories. And this has no relevance to your claim either.


Already done. Documented, experimentally verifiable evidence exists. The pleasure centers of the brain have been studied extensively for years. Tens of thousands of pages of journal articles and data, experiments, and so on exist.



The facts are: you have yet to provide evidence to support your claim that 'god exists,' and everything you HAVE provided so far has been irrelevant to this claim.

To deacon, yes earlier the Big Bang Theory was mentioned "Idiot"
Also, in my heart i know. I don't care how technical you get but i will spread the word.

Also Sythe (Without Deacon jumping in like a little 3 year old child)

I'm not scared of death, and never will be. I know where i am going.
So, my question is what do you think happens after death?
You are erased forever into the nothingness of space?
Are you a athiest just because of the meer fact that you are scared of death, therefore try to bash on as many Christians as you can so someone can finally agree with youre scientifical papers and research.
When you are on your death bed i guess you will see for yourself.
I will spread the word about God as much as i can. You can't stop me.
So at the end of the day, i'm happy for you.
I'm glad you can look upon scientifical papers for your "meaning" of life.
It's rather sad, i mean honestly. Athiests just seem like the most stuck up, material people in the world.

 

[Angelmax]

I dont understand deacons logic about enjoying his life am i crazy sythe? do you share his oppionions on valuing life despite it being pointless if their is nothing after death?

you are failing to make me understand you deacon for example you cant think at all let alone value what you did in life after death so therefore i am confused at the purpose of living without an afterlife.

So are you saying we shouldn't enjoy our one and only life, because we have nothing afterwards?
What is the point of that, the only thing we will ever do, ever is live, and you say we should not do that because after a point we will not be able to?

 

[lalmvpkobe]

Why does there have to be something after death for it to be meaningful?

-who is it meaningful to(since we shall all die)? and show evidence that it is meaningful.


The proof that I don't hurt them, I talk to them frequently, I visit them when I can, I hug them, and I wish they wouldn't go away for a long while is proof.

-this is a claim not evidence. also subjective (you may only think you are not hurting them)


As for the enjoyment, sadness, and etc, those have been proven to exist, my claiming I've had them is rational.
just because something exists doesnt mean it is evidence for your claim. as a matter of fact show me evidence of their existance.

proof/evidence is allways subjective.

 

[Deacon Frost]

To deacon, yes earlier the Big Bang Theory was mentioned "Idiot"
Also, in my heart i know. I don't care how technical you get but i will spread the word.

No need for name calling.

Also Sythe (Without Deacon jumping in like a little 3 year old child)

3 year old? How so?

I'm not scared of death, and never will be. I know where i am going.
So, my question is what do you think happens after death?
You are erased forever into the nothingness of space?
Are you a athiest just because of the meer fact that you are scared of death, therefore try to bash on as many Christians as you can so someone can finally agree with youre scientifical papers and research.
When you are on your death bed i guess you will see for yourself.
I will spread the word about God as much as i can. You can't stop me.
So at the end of the day, i'm happy for you.
I'm glad you can look upon scientifical papers for your "meaning" of life.
It's rather sad, i mean honestly. Athiests just seem like the most stuck up, material people in the world.

Most atheists are fearless, actually. And, we're not the most stuck up people in the world? That would be the theists . The people who'll kill others for not believing the same as them.

Ya know, Crusades, Salem Witch Trials, 9/11, now 'project iraqi freedom', it's all because others believe differently. We're just trying to keep you guys from killing everyone =/.

 

I dont understand deacons logic about enjoying his life am i crazy sythe? do you share his oppionions on valuing life despite it being pointless if their is nothing after death?

This is totally bizzare. Have you that little self respect you need others to assign your life value for you? Your life has exactly the value you assign it. Your *values* are your personal subjective valuations of all the things in the world, from your perspective. If you claim your life has no value, then the only reason that could be is because you've neglected to assign any value to it!

OMG I JUST THOUGHT OF A GOOD POINT-show me proof/evidence you value your family? show me proof you enjoyed that vidogame or you were happy you graduated show me proof that you were ever sad...etc....
-gf

But I'm not making any of those claims, so the matter is of no relevance.

But they would be opinions even if I did make those claims. If I am saying "I like icecream" then this is an opinion, and remains one because I am unwilling to substantiate it with evidence.