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do we invent math or find math?

son of madoff

son of madoff

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Was (is) Math discovered or invented?
Please back up your answer with a reason.

in your response please include a few answers to these mind bottlers!

-if aliens came here wud they kno 1+1 is 3?

-is math realy a language that we all speak?

-how do you kno that 1+1=2? whos to say it isnt 4? or 3?

-is it possible that math has always been there but mathematicians create axioms to prove theyr work and work backwards?

example
in 'regular math' 12+6= 18
but if we are using the axiom of a clock 12(pm)+6(hrs)=6(am)

-how could so many ancient civilizations live for so long without even having a representation for '0' or negative numbers?
-does this mean our system is bullshit?
 
Well first to make sure this is what we're talking about:
Discovered: It always existed, and then somebody found it.
Invented: Did not exist before somebody created it.

I think it's maybe a little bit of both. While math itself was obviously invented, what it models certainly wasn't. I see no reason why certain ratio's in nature didn't exist before somebody wrote about them, etc.
 
Well you can't invent a number, but numbers are actually real, they're imaginary. You can't hold a two in your hand, so I'd say it was more invented.
 
DropKick Murphys said:
Well first to make sure this is what we're talking about:
Discovered: It always existed, and then somebody found it.
Invented: Did not exist before somebody created it.

I think it's maybe a little bit of both. While math itself was obviously invented, what it models certainly wasn't. I see no reason why certain ratio's in nature didn't exist before somebody wrote about them, etc.
Click to expand...

I'm disappointed in you, you pose no questions :D

I think that math was invented, but it's just a guess. I really can't see this topic going into a deep discussion though. It could go either way on one hand someone could say math provides algorithms which allow for answers to specific problems. On the other hand math could have been discovered due to the fact that these problems need an explanation which was perhaps always there.
 
It all depends on your beliefs. If you believe in creation, then you would have to say we found it because you believe that a god created everything and if someone created the universe then they would have needed this math to make it all work. On the other hand if the universe simply existed or if it didn't have an all knowing creator then humans would have invented it because when you think about it numbers are only numbers because we say they are. I could make up a numbering system that says q = 1 and *=2 and / = 3 and so on, or totally random scribblings. It seems more logical that it was invented and not found but the invention may also have been less of an invention and more of just using your resources to better yourselves.
 
justafan said:
It all depends on your beliefs. If you believe in creation, then you would have to say we found it because you believe that a god created everything and if someone created the universe then they would have needed this math to make it all work. On the other hand if the universe simply existed or if it didn't have an all knowing creator then humans would have invented it because when you think about it numbers are only numbers because we say they are. I could make up a numbering system that says q = 1 and *=2 and / = 3 and so on, or totally random scribblings. It seems more logical that it was invented and not found but the invention may also have been less of an invention and more of just using your resources to better yourselves.
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if aliens came here wud they kno 1+1 is 3?
is math realy a language that we all speak?
 
son of madoff said:
if aliens came here wud they kno 1+1 is 3?
is math realy a language that we all speak?
Click to expand...

Firstly, 1+1=2.

Secondly, math isn't a language we all speak obviously. When you were born, did you understand the concept the math? Moreover, did you know the simple calculations? Clearly not. Math is a language/subject which we are introduced to and taught how to compute the process.
 
Graham said:
Firstly, 1+1=2.

Secondly, math isn't a language we all speak obviously. When you were born, did you understand the concept the math? Moreover, did you know the simple calculations? Clearly not. Math is a language/subject which we are introduced to and taught how to compute the process.
Click to expand...

when you wer born did you kno english or teh concepts of english? no, but you wer taught it by other people, same as math
how do you kno that 1+1=2? whos to say it isnt 4? or 3?
 
Think about this.
is it possible that math has always been there but mathematicians create axioms to prove theyr work and work backwards?

example
in 'regular math' 12+6= 18
but if we are using the axiom of a clock 12(pm)+6(hrs)=6(am)
 
We invented the system of celebrating it, but it's always existed.

For example, whether or not the numbers "1" and "2" existed, if you have one of something and you get another, you have two.

We just named the quantities.
 
son of madoff said:
math is the language of science? then what is science? is science invented aswell?
Click to expand...

Great, make it even more complicated.

My thoughts: These 'things' always existed, but people had to discover it and give it a name. Just a simple example; the Pythagorean theorem. A^2 + B^2 = C^2 has always been this way; triangles have also always been this way, but people had to discover it and give it a name and a way to fit into eachother.

The numbers 0-9 have always existed, but we had to give it a symbol. We could have also give it the name 篆* for the number 0, it would still be the same.


*I just took a random chinese character from wikiped. This character means 'chinese' if I'm right.
 
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We invented equations and theories to translate it. One dog and one dog has always meant two dogs. We never really discovered it, but we never really invented it. We merely translated it.
 
Math was invented. If some guy didn't say 2+2=4 then the next would have said it equals 5. Numbers are invented just like words.
 
The theory of counting and keeping track of anything lead to the development to math. The concept of math may have been found* but in literal terms as in assigning names, theories, properties for math was invented.
 
Math was neither discovered nor invented. It's just an idea that is extremely logical and can be used to predict just about anything.
 
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