Suicide.

[Sorry Im F2P]

I once tried to kill my self. It's not a big deal to me anymore but hey, I feel like it means I can talk about the subject with a decent understanding of the thought process...

Ever since I tried, I've personally felt pathetic, not for my life, not for the reasons I tried to do it. I feel pathetic because I let something get the better of me and I was ready to call it quits. I was told I had depression told I needed pills etc etc.

Bollocks. If you have a severe medical condition then ok, if you're terminally ill, if you're disabled to the point life isn't liveable ok. I agree with assisted suicide.

If it's something personal going on in your life. No. Not at all. According to Doctors I was a train wreck with my depression, alcoholism the works. I didn't see depression as a mental illness, I saw it as a mind set. Is being happy all the time an illness? No, you just have a positive outlook, is being sad all the time a mental illness? no, you just have a negative outlook. I realised this and I changed my self, I removed stress, I removed pain, I removed it all. I'm a better person for it.

I feel pathetic knowing I tried to quit, i've never quit at anything in my life cos it beat me. I'm sure as hell glad I didn't do it and I will sure as hell never attempt it again as long as I live.

 

Swell.



If you go to counseling willingly, then yes, it can be of help over time. But I'm talking about facilities where your parents take you and drop you off at, such as North-Star (Place here in Alaska, not sure where else it is, cbf to do research) where parents drop off their "troubled" children, along the lines of delinquents to depressed children, to just kids who backtalk their parents. Or any other facilities where you drop off your child to get help. If the child doesn't want to go it's not going to help most of the time and usually makes things worse. If the person doesn't want help, trying to help won't make it any better. They have to help themselves first.

(North-Star is for kids/teens hence why I used children)



You are still wrong about my friends. I can't explain it to you if you have no experience and will stay closed-minded over the subject. Arguing with you is like arguing over the topic if God exists to a profound Christian.

And in his example he's saying if you call people who are suicidal weak, you are calling disabled people weak.

> I call suicidal people weak
> He says I'm calling disabled people weak

Where is the correlation? His example makes no sense.

You should look up suicide statistics of the past 3 years and tell me if disabilities are a significant cause of suicide. The ratios may surprise you.

 

Bollocks. If you have a severe medical condition then ok, if you're terminally ill, if you're disabled to the point life isn't liveable ok. I agree with assisted suicide.

If it's something personal going on in your life. No. Not at all. According to Doctors I was a train wreck with my depression, alcoholism the works. I didn't see depression as a mental illness, I saw it as a mind set.

I do applaud you for getting through it; takes a lot of character. However, as someone who understands how horrible it can be, then how can you call it bollocks when some people have it 24/7 for no reason such as events in their life and so on, seems a bit odd.

> I call suicidal people weak
> He says I'm calling disabled people weak

Where is the correlation? His example makes no sense.

You should look up suicide statistics of the past 3 years and tell me if disabilities are a significant cause of suicide. The ratios may surprise you.

If I have to explain the correlation one more time and you don't address, I think I will kill myself, bad taste of joke intended.

 

"It's a part of the body that's functioning wrongly and needs medical attention. You're saying "too weak to get help" which is like saying "to weak to walk"."

Overcoming despair =/= Seeking medical attention

Your clause makes no sense.

 

[Stickly]

If it's something personal going on in your life. No. Not at all. According to Doctors I was a train wreck with my depression, alcoholism the works. I didn't see depression as a mental illness, I saw it as a mind set. Is being happy all the time an illness? No, you just have a positive outlook, is being sad all the time a mental illness? no, you just have a negative outlook. I realised this and I changed my self, I removed stress, I removed pain, I removed it all. I'm a better person for it.

First off, glad you pulled through well.

Next, the bolded part. I'm not sure what you're saying here exactly, I re-read this a few times, but are you saying depression is just because of having a negative outlook? I mean, sure that is a part of some peoples depression, but that's not even close to everything.

> I call suicidal people weak
> He says I'm calling disabled people weak

Where is the correlation? His example makes no sense.

You should look up suicide statistics of the past 3 years and tell me if disabilities are a significant cause of suicide. The ratios may surprise you.

It's a part of the body that's functioning wrongly and needs medical attention. You're saying "too weak to get help" which is like saying "to weak to walk".

He already answered you. Stop dodging it. Please go back and read the replies and reply to what we've said before moving on.

It seems you can't understand it, stop for a bit and think it over. It makes sense, just think a bit.

 

[ughh..]

Might be a dumb but

Can you not suffer from depression and still comtemplate suicide? Can someone be happy and healthy yet still think they just don't want to be in this world? Or is the fact that you want to kill yourself proof you are not in your right mind and need help?

I don't this is just black and white. Some people are just thinking irrationally and others have their mind set and cannot have their minds changed because they don't want to change

 

[Naxious]

Always ghast and roary with different perspectives lol. Anyways on topic, suicide is for people that know they they will not move foward in life and lost everything. But to me, I think you should keep trying at least because I think we were granted life for a reason, not to kill ourselves

 

Might be a dumb but

Can you not suffer from depression and still comtemplate suicide? Can someone be happy and healthy yet still think they just don't want to be in this world? Or is the fact that you want to kill yourself proof you are not in your right mind and need help?

I don't this is just black and white. Some people are just thinking irrationally and others have their mind set and cannot have their minds changed because they don't want to change

Yes - some people are just sensitive and come to that conclusion more easily. I still don't think it makes them weak, it just makes them sensitive and overly ruled by emotion.


Here's some food for thought. Some depression needs medical attention because it IS a disability.

http://www.mayoclinic.org/tests-pro...scan-of-the-brain-for-depression/img-20007400

"It's a part of the body that's functioning wrongly and needs medical attention. You're saying "too weak to get help" which is like saying "to weak to walk"."

Overcoming despair =/= Seeking medical attention

Your clause makes no sense.

And you're still ignoring the point I'm making. I'm not saying you can overcome not being able to walk. But me saying that as an example is the same as you saying "just get help" - it isn't possible in most cases to just wake up, go get help and be happy.

I think we were granted life for a reason, not to kill ourselves

Interesting point; who says it's wrong to kill oneself? (if I were to be Devil's advocate here). Nobody knows if killing oneself is any more right than living a long, insignificant life - a speck in the midst of everything - to die anyway.

 

[Stickly]

Might be a dumb but

Can you not suffer from depression and still comtemplate suicide? Can someone be happy and healthy yet still think they just don't want to be in this world? Or is the fact that you want to kill yourself proof you are not in your right mind and need help?

I don't this is just black and white. Some people are just thinking irrationally and others have their mind set and cannot have their minds changed because they don't want to change

You can want to kill yourself without being depressed, sure. You're bored of the world, hope for something more. That's just one example. I don't really know for sure, but I'm sure there are plenty of reasons aside from depression/sadness.

Always ghast and roary with different perspectives lol. Anyways on topic, suicide is for people that know they they will not move foward in life and lost everything. But to me, I think you should keep trying at least because I think we were granted life for a reason, not to kill ourselves

Of course I don't want people to kill themselves, but honestly, if someone is on to the point of wanting to kill themselves and won't go for help, won't listen. Don't force them to stay alive. Don't use our money for them, use it for the people who want to live. I guess it sounds bad, but that's how I feel.

 

[Naxious]

Yes - some people are just sensitive and come to that conclusion more easily. I still don't think it makes them weak, it just makes them sensitive and overly ruled by emotion.


Here's some food for thought. Some depression needs medical attention because it IS a disability.

http://www.mayoclinic.org/tests-pro...scan-of-the-brain-for-depression/img-20007400



And you're still ignoring the point I'm making. I'm not saying you can overcome not being able to walk. But me saying that as an example is the same as you saying "just get help" - it isn't possible in most cases to just wake up, go get help and be happy.


Interesting point; who says it's wrong to kill oneself? (if I were to be Devil's advocate here). Nobody knows if killing oneself is any more right than living a long, insignificant life - a speck in the midst of everything - to die anyway.

This is the part where religion jumps in. I don't want to say anything wrong but many religions believe killing themselves is a big sin and that's what prevents some people

 

[Stickly]

This is the part where religion jumps in. I don't want to say anything wrong but many religions believe killing themselves is a big sin and that's what prevents some people

If one is on the verge of killing their selves, I don't think religion is gonna do much. Sure, it's stopped people, but I don't believe that it plays a big role. Society says it's wrong to kill oneself, as do religions as Nax pointed out.

 

[Divine_God]

It's the same thing. A part of the body isn't functioning properly. You aren't in your right mind when you choose to do that and it's not physically possible to look on the "bright side" or "just get help" sometimes. You don't "feel it's necessary", there's nothing else in your mind all day but death.

Go live some, please.

Who says that suicide is the brain not functioning properly? Depression may lead to suicide which is the brain acting in a certain way but in no way shape or form does depression force anyone to take their lives. The individual is ENTIRELY responsible for that decision, not their "disability".

Second, you entirely miss the group of people who commit suicide willingly without being depressed.

Are you setting a standard for human thought? If so then please enlighten me.

You argument relies entirely on the thought that suicide is undertaken by those uncapable of choosing an alternative option, or so impaired (from the standard you set) that they don't hold responsibility in the situation.

I may be in the minority thinking it's courageous...but to cease life with no clue what happens after, if anything, is more courageous than cowardly to me.

If suicide is the response to a problem that may otherwise be solved without having to injure those around you then we, as social creatures, should view it as cowardly. Yes, it may take some guts to kill ones self but personally if I decided to take my life I wouldn't hesitate or leave it to chance.

 

[I Bleed Duke Blue]

Who says that suicide is the brain not functioning properly? Depression may lead to suicide which is the brain acting in a certain way but in no way shape or form does depression force anyone to take their lives. The individual is ENTIRELY responsible for that decision, not their "disability".

Second, you entirely miss the group of people who commit suicide willingly without being depressed.

Are you setting a standard for human thought? If so then please enlighten me.

You argument relies entirely on the thought that suicide is undertaken by those uncapable of choosing an alternative option, or so impaired (from the standard you set) that they don't hold responsibility in the situation.




If suicide is the response to a problem that may otherwise be solved without having to injure those around you then we, as social creatures, should view it as cowardly. Yes, it may take some guts to kill ones self but personally if I decided to take my life I wouldn't hesitate or leave it to chance.

But who are we to say that it may or may not be solved? Their mindset is that it cannot be solved. I accidentally deleted my first post. I didn't think I formulated it well enough. But I see your point. It's valid but to put yourself into the mindset of someone about to do something so permanent, so final, is impossible.

 

I'm not applying my "argument" (fact) to everyone; I have already addressed that people who are not clinically depressed kill themselves. Regardless, one does not willingly (personal opinion) do so without being somewhat mentally damaged in some way - NOT weakness.

For those clinically depressed, yes it's technically a choice; but a coerced one (by the mental condition), therefore not (arguably; depending on your definition of freedom), a free choice.

 

[Divine_God]

I'm not applying my "argument" (fact) to everyone; I have already addressed that people who are not clinically depressed kill themselves. But one does not willingly do so without being somewhat mentally damaged in some way.

For those clinically depressed, yes it's technically a choice; but a coerced one (by the mental condition), therefore not (arguably depending on your definition of freedom, a free choice.

What information do you have access to that implicates humans must in some way be mentally damaged in order to kill themselves?

How can it not be perfectly natural for an individual to choose to end their life? No evolutionary benefit? Goes against societal norms? Goes against one of your inherit instincts? Goes against psychology?

None of those things factually prove that suicide goes against human nature or proves that one must be mentally damaged.

( Humans may very well have an inherent nature, and your point could be true. I just have not seen a convincing argument that proves humans MUST have a certain way of thinking. )

 

That's my personal opinion, and just a statement of thought; the least important sentence in what I just posted. I don't need sources to have an opinion - which I dont care about not having evidence, its based on my own personal (and inductive, what you picked up on) experiences. I hoped pointing out it was personal opinion would stop you focusing on that one thing but I edited too late xD

The rest is relevant to your reply to mine, sorry

 

[United as one]

Agree with ghast, suicide IS for the weak, no matter how "depressed" you are there's always someone in a worse situation living life to the full, some cases I can see why but the little 13-16 y/o kids who suicide over school is just extremely pathetic, no matter the case they're being ignorant and selfish.

 

Agree with ghast, suicide IS for the weak, no matter how "depressed" you are there's always someone in a worse situation living life to the full, some cases I can see why but the little 13-16 y/o kids who suicide over school is just extremely pathetic, no matter the case they're being ignorant and selfish.

ignorant

Yes, that's you. Look up things before you argue about them please. Depression doesn't always happen because your life 'sucks', it happens for no reason. There's no reason to feel depressed but you do, because it's an illness.

 

[Stickly]

Who says that suicide is the brain not functioning properly? Depression may lead to suicide which is the brain acting in a certain way but in no way shape or form does depression force anyone to take their lives. The individual is ENTIRELY responsible for that decision, not their "disability".

Of course, the individual is always at fault for suicide. Just as any person is trying drugs, skipping school, shoplifting, so on. It's another decision, and at points, easy to make for some people.

Second, you entirely miss the group of people who commit suicide willingly without being depressed.

Are you setting a standard for human thought? If so then please enlighten me.

You argument relies entirely on the thought that suicide is undertaken by those uncapable of choosing an alternative option, or so impaired (from the standard you set) that they don't hold responsibility in the situation.

We were answering due to Ghast saying they're weak. This wasn't really brought up, so I'll try and address it now. I still do not think they're weak. It takes a large amount of courage and strength to end your own life. Anyway, if they choose to do so without being pushed overboard, no point in trying to help them.

You are just pointing out flaws in his argument while not contributing to the argument at all. Need more information.

What information do you have access to that implicates humans must in some way be mentally damaged in order to kill themselves?

How can it not be perfectly natural for an individual to choose to end their life? No evolutionary benefit? Goes against societal norms? Goes against one of your inherit instincts? Goes against psychology?

None of those things factually prove that suicide goes against human nature or proves that one must be mentally damaged.

( Humans may very well have an inherent nature, and your point could be true. I just have not seen a convincing argument that proves humans MUST have a certain way of thinking. )

Using your point, nothing is correct or incorrect then, therefore nothing should matter. We set guidelines for ourselves in the most acceptable ways. Without doing so, society would end up in complete anarchy, therefore causing us to disappear.

Agree with ghast, suicide IS for the weak, no matter how "depressed" you are there's always someone in a worse situation living life to the full, some cases I can see why but the little 13-16 y/o kids who suicide over school is just extremely pathetic, no matter the case they're being ignorant and selfish.

Read more then a post. Just even skim through the posts..


Sorry, just woke up, when I'm more awake I'll correct myself if it doesn't make sense.

 

[United as one]

Yes, that's you. Look up things before you argue about them please. Depression doesn't always happen because your life 'sucks', it happens for no reason. There's no reason to feel depressed but you do, because it's an illness.

Last time I checked this thread was about SUICIDE and not depression, pls we get ur points about depression we are talking about suicide here