[Denied] Oblige trading-servers to notify their Users when they change their ToS

Simple suggestion but absolutely necessary. Inspired by this dispute: PVM Services - Poor Trading Practices

-Atm there's a consent-obligation, meaning that ToS only apply when Users explicitly consent to them.
-A way to get around this is to change the ToS at any given time after a specific User has consented to them. The ToS-post just shows the info 'edited', but does not show when this info has been edited, therefore there is no way to know whether the User has been able to explicitly agree to the changes (as it's unclear whether he toggled accept prior or post the changes).

My server has the following construction to deal with this issue:
-Whenever ToS are changed, I delete the previous ToS-post and post the new version. Discord then shows when the new ToS is posted. Because this is an unedited new post, there is no way that this has been modified from the moment it has been posted and it should thus apply to anyone who toggled consent after it was explicitly posted.
-I notify in announcements what changed and tag everyone. In addition, I notify everyone personally who has an ongoing ticket.

This is my construction, but other constructions are obviously are also possible. For instance, servers can ask their Users to re-toggle the new ToS.

Suggestion: The main point is that Users should be made aware of what changed (in the sense of their rights) by the Server. In addition, when a ToS-post shows 'edited', it should always be the server's burden of proof to show that the User explicitly agreed to the applicable newest provisions, as they have the freedom to edit them at any given moment in time.

 

Isn't there an edit button on Discord which shows the exact time when a message has been edited? So it would be obvious if the ToS were updated after they had been agreed to

 

You're right. Learned something new. If you hover the edited sign you can see when it has been edited.
Anyway, I still think it's necessary to make it mandatory to notify all users of changes in the ToS. Users shouldn't have the recheck the ToS after they toggled accept to see when they've been edited. That's on the server

 

I support this as well.

 

Support. It seems like they can change their TOS to match whatever they want at any time without notifying the users and then leaving users that are used to the same TOS with the excuse of "welp, your own fault. Should have done research" when they exactly hope and pray that users do NOT read tos or keep up with them.

 

I heavily support this. Also to add Black, if you use a tickettool or carlbot I don’t believe it will show an edit time stamp. Just from my experiences so far dealing with [redacted -BB] and their attempt to alter TOS when I asked for a refund.

 

I think there should be an @everyone sent out in a service discord if their ToS is updated explaining what was changed/added/removed and then after that pause training on all services until they agree to the ToS changes or offer a partial/full refund on all unfinished services.

Id say the second part is the most important over notifying unless you are willing to continue the service under your old ToS.

So id only support this if this was also added “pause training on all services until they agree to the ToS changes or offer a partial/full refund on all unfinished services.”

 

I agree and disagree (only a little).

Users should be aware of ToS when entering a server.
Users should be aware and agree in their own ticket of the ToS before a trade even occurs. (Obviously can't be changed mid-transaction.)
Finally, Users should be updated every time a server / service updates their ToS. This is best for business so people don't speed press buttons and get caught up in something that has changed over time.

Any smart business owner would implement a good business model regarding ToS.

 

I agree all users should be updated when TOS change.
Every company with a user agreement or privacy agreement will notify customers of changes.
It gives the user the opportunity to accept or decline the changes.

You can not assume someone’s compliance or willingness to agree. You have to have confirmation.

So yes, strongly agree.

 

Wouldn't this be too hard to monitor? And you can't really know what has been edited, the server owner could just lie and say grammar edits...?

 

No need to monitor, just have this work in favor of a customer in the case of a dispute.
As Gladiator already mentioned, you can already see when the ToS have been edited. If the ToS don't come clean (that means, they have been edited post-agreement), then it's the server's burden of proof to show what's been edited.

 

I support and think the quoted part of @Poat's post would be ideal. I think the second half of that post is too drastic; existing orders should continue with the ToS under which they were agreed.

 

Support this, good suggestion.

 

I don't play Runescape at all anymore but yes, I feel this should be a thing. If someone joins a server today and in 3 months the ToS changes all users should be made aware and fully accept the new terms. Also if the new terms start during someone's mid service they should be bound by the old terms as that is what they agreed to prior the changes.

 

I support this suggestion.

 

We discussed this and don't see a realistic way to police this. We encourage users to save permanent copies (i.e. Sythe PMs, screenshots) of the ToS they agree to.

We'll revisit this if this becomes an issue in the future.