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Is the insanity plea a legitimate defense?

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As some of you may know, the Norway killer recently got out of a long, or most likely life ending sentence with the insanity plea.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2011/11/29/norway-killer-insanity-plea.html

While Norwegian Anders Behring Breivik has been deemed insane by a panel of psychiatrists, meaning he likely won't face time behind prison bars, the confessed mass killer may have faced a different fate in Canada.

"It's entirely possible," Prof. Roy O'Shaughnessy, head of the forensic psychiatry program at the University of British Columbia, told CBC News. "This would have been in a court of law and would have been subjected to an extremely vigorous cross-examination."

A psychiatric evaluation ordered by an Oslo court found that Breivik is not mentally fit to be sentenced to prison because he was "psychotic" during the July 22 attacks that led to the deaths of 77 people and injured 151. The 243-page evaluation still has be reviewed by a panel from the Norwegian Board of Forensic Medicine.

Anders Behring Breivik sits in a police vehicle after a hearing in Oslo. A psychiatric evaluation found that Breivik is not mentally fit to be sentenced to prison because he was 'psychotic' during the July 22, 2011, attacks that led to the deaths of 77 people and injured 151. Jon-Are Berg-Jacobsen/Aftenposten/Associated Press
Canada and Norway have different criteria for finding a person mentally unfit, and who makes that determination also differs between the two countries.

"Each country has different criteria that they impose on how you determine whether a person is criminally responsible for their behaviour. And in Canadian jurisprudence, as well as all Commonwealth countries and the U.S., that decision is only made by the courts, not by psychiatrists," O'Shaughnessy said.

Under Section 16 of Canada's Criminal Code, a person is deemed to be not criminally responsible (the term 'insane' having been scrapped) if the crime was committed while "suffering from a mental disorder that rendered the person incapable of appreciating the nature and quality of the act or omission or of knowing that it was wrong."

O'Shaughnessy said the issue of responsibility is determined by a number of factors.

"Did the person have a severe mental disorder at the time of the offence. They're clearly saying [Breivik] did. But in Canadian jurisprudence, simply having a mental disorder, even severe, doesn't mean you're going to be held not criminally responsible.

"You then have to apply the disorder to the facts of the case and reach the conclusion as to whether the disorder was of such severity that it caused him to be unaware what he was doing was wrong in a moral as well as legal sense."

O'Shaughnessy said an accused person can be delusional and have beliefs that are incorrect but may still be held responsible if that person appreciates what they were doing was wrong.

'Here's the bottom line for Canadian law …. The only relevance of a delusion would be if it affects his capacity to appreciate the nature and quality of the act. Which means, did he understand he was firing a gun which had the potential to kill somebody? And clearly he did.'

—Osgoode Hall Law School Prof. Alan Young
"You may well believe there are elements of society that are evil or they've harmed you in some way and you want to get revenge on them. You would still be well aware that that behaviour is wrong."

O'Shaughnessy said it's difficult to conclude whether Breivik would be considered not criminally responsible in Canada without knowing details about his mental state.

"Quite literally, the devil is in the details," he said.

Osgoode Hall Law School Prof. Alan Young said the person has to suffer from some kind of cognitive impairment — someone who can't perceive reality or appreciate the nature and quality of their act, has some kind of psychosis or break with reality due to delusions.

According to Norwegian prosecutors, the psychiatric report described Breivik as a man "in his own delusional universe" where all his thoughts and acts are governed by these delusions and that during a long period of time developed the mental disorder of paranoid schizophrenia, which changed him.

"Here's the bottom line for Canadian law. Delusions or no delusions," Young said. "The only relevance of a delusion would be if it affects his capacity to appreciate the nature and quality of the act. Which means, did he understand he was firing a gun which had the potential to kill somebody? And clearly he did.


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A building burns following a powerful explosion that struck government headquarters, including the office of Prime Minister Jens Stoltenberg on July 22, 2011. (Holm Morten/Scanpix/AP)
"Or he could be found insane if his delusions led him to believe that his actions were morally justifiable. That I don't know but I would doubt that because it just seems that he was getting his inspiration from his own ideological thought patterns and not acting on behalf of some greater power.

"So my preliminary assessment on limited facts, would be … [Breivik] would be found sane by Canadian and American standards."

But Young said further information could reveal that Breivik believed his delusional set of beliefs were sanctioned from a higher power, meaning he might be considered not criminally responsible.

Patrice Band, a Toronto criminal defence lawyer, added that some who believe they must declare war on the powers that be because they have a certain ideological persuasion may not be delusional or psychotic.

"It just may be a political mindset. And I'm not sure which it is in the case of Breivik because the stuff you read about his manifesto really sounded like the latter, he really believed he was engaged in social and policy warfare.

"Whether he actually believed as a matter of fact he was acting in self-defence is another story."


Quest is as follows: Do you think the insanity plea is a legitimate defense?
 
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Never. If money is going to be spent taking care of someone for the rest of their life, they are nothing more than a burden on society, therefore better off dead.
 
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In my opinion, if someone is 'insane' that should just make their legal matters worse, and if anything, result in an even lengthier sentence, as being defined as 'insane' simply means you are even more of a threat to the general public.
 
Yes being insane is a completely legit defense.... If you cannot tell what you are doing is good or bad because of brain problems why should you be tried for it?
 
Yes being insane is a completely legit defense.... If you cannot tell what you are doing is good or bad because of brain problems why should you be tried for it?

I like Ron White's Quote on insanity.

"We can't kill him! He's too crazy to know were killing him!" "Then what the hell are we arguing about?If he doesn't know the difference and it makes me feel better!"
 
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Would you sent a highly autistic kid who killed his parents to jail?
 
Yes being insane is a completely legit defense.... If you cannot tell what you are doing is good or bad because of brain problems why should you be tried for it?
What would you do then? I agree they shouldn't be thrown in jail with the "sane" criminals. They should be kept away from society though. The insanity plea is only good for keeping them out of a normal prison. Thats it and should not get anyone off the hook.

Would you sent a highly autistic kid who killed his parents to jail?
No, send them to somewhere so they won't be a danger to society.
 
I think it depends on the severity of the crime. In my opinion, insanity can be influential to a person's actions but the person still has at least some control over what he does. Is it a legitimate defense in my eyes? No. But I can understand under certain circumstances the eligibility to plea insanity.
 
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Yes, let's kill all the elderly.

Most of the elderly I know are pretty well set in terms of money. They've also already put in their time, not to mention the fact that they're not necessarily criminals.
 
If the person is legitly insane then i think they shouldn't be in a sane environment in the first place because whatever they do will be wrong. that's like putting a lion in a deer habitat at the zoo then punishing the lion for eating the deer. i think if a person is truly insane they should be able to live in an insane asylum not punished for doing things they cant help.
 
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No, send them to somewhere so they won't be a danger to society.

Right... So if someone is deemed insane, send them to a mental hospital.
 
I think that in certain cases, the insanity plea can definitely be a legitimate defence.

The people who get off as being "insane", such as Anders Behring Breivik or the "Norway Killer", will not get sent to prison but its NOT like they are getting off the hook and get to walk free. He will likely spend the remainder of his life in its entirety in a mental institution, where he will be locked up, monitered, and reside in a safe environment where he causes no harm to either himself or those people around him. He will probably be heavily medicated and go through intense therapy and spend the rest of his life battling his illness in this institution until he dies.

This is just as bad as prison and essentially the same sort of concept; he will be removed from the public and locked up for the safety of everybody. A person like him would most likely be even more dangerous in a prison environment, locked up with other violent criminals and people with mental disorders who are not treated properly. There is likely a high chance that he would either initiate, or be the victim of even further violence behind bars as he struggled to adjust to the prison life.

Although some may think he deserves to rot in the prison environment anyways, the majority (if not all) of people in prison would have to be considered "sane", and somebody as violent, delusional, and mentally disturbed as him is probably better off being segregated from the general prison population.
 
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Right... So if someone is deemed insane, send them to a mental hospital.

I think it should still be socially acceptable to banish people from society. Send them to an island in the Pacific and let them do what they please.
 
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