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Time, did man create it.

Do you agree or disagree that man create time?

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  • Poll closed .
No we didn't "create" time, we created a way that is effective of measuring time on our planet.

Our time is, and always will be infinite. Unless you suggest that numbers aren't infinite. I can keep counting back or forward in hours, seconds, minutes or whatever you like and it would never stop.

If we're regarding time based on gravity then I would happily argue that it is infinite. The big bang is a fine theory to explain how our universe actually gained its enormous size however it doesn't explain how it was there in the first place. I would apply argue that everything that exists always existed because before it existed, it never existed but for it to exist it must have always existed even if you call existing to be nothing. Since even nothing is something.

The whole topic of whether time is infinite depends on whether numbers are infinite, with infinite numbers comes an infinite amount of time, with an infinite amount of time comes an infinite amount of universes. With everything being infinite comes a few weird things, it means that im sat here typing this an infinite amount of times with everything being exactly the same. If anyone ever reads this, they will have read it an infinite amount of times before and an infinite amount of times after. So really this topic should be, does infinity exist? To which I have to answer yes.
 
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matt_sells said:
No we didn't "create" time, we created a way that is effective of measuring time on our planet.

Our time is, and always will be infinite. Unless you suggest that numbers aren't infinite. I can keep counting back or forward in hours, seconds, minutes or whatever you like and it would never stop.

If we're regarding time based on gravity then I would happily argue that it is infinite. The big bang is a fine theory to explain how our universe actually gained its enormous size however it doesn't explain how it was there in the first place. I would apply argue that everything that exists always existed because before it existed, it never existed but for it to exist it must have always existed even if you call existing to be nothing. Since even nothing is something.

The whole topic of whether time is infinite depends on whether numbers are infinite, with infinite numbers comes an infinite amount of time, with an infinite amount of time comes an infinite amount of universes. With everything being infinite comes a few weird things, it means that im sat here typing this an infinite amount of times with everything being exactly the same. If anyone ever reads this, they will have read it an infinite amount of times before and an infinite amount of times after. So really this topic should be, does infinity exist? To which I have to answer yes.
Click to expand...

Time has nothing to do with gravity in respect to our argument of it being infinite. Just thought I would put that out there. The Universe is ever expanding, which means that it has a boundary which means that it isn't infinite. It can, in theory, expand infinitely but it will always have a bound which means that it will never be infinite. Bit of a paradox, but it is true if you think about it. From a human perspective it would be infinite because we are never going to get there, but it has boundaries which means that it isn't infinite right there. Time is undeniably linked to space, which means that as an extension of space time isn't infinite. Time relies on our laws of physics to exist and before the Big Bang the laws of physics break down, which means time breaks down. That is why it has proved especially difficult to figure out the early universe and before that.


Think about it like this: You have a balloon that can never break and you begin to gradually fill it up with air. Now imagine you are shrunk down and standing on a quark that is stationary looking out. The balloon has a boundary and is finite, but from the position on the quark it looks infinite because if you scale speed to the environment and you try to make it to the edge you never will.
 
Emperor_Nero said:
Time has nothing to do with gravity in respect to our argument of it being infinite. Just thought I would put that out there. The Universe is ever expanding, which means that it has a boundary which means that it isn't infinite. It can, in theory, expand infinitely but it will always have a bound which means that it will never be infinite. Bit of a paradox, but it is true if you think about it. From a human perspective it would be infinite because we are never going to get there, but it has boundaries which means that it isn't infinite right there. Time is undeniably linked to space, which means that as an extension of space time isn't infinite. Time relies on our laws of physics to exist and before the Big Bang the laws of physics break down, which means time breaks down. That is why it has proved especially difficult to figure out the early universe and before that.


Think about it like this: You have a balloon that can never break and you begin to gradually fill it up with air. Now imagine you are shrunk down and standing on a quark that is stationary looking out. The balloon has a boundary and is finite, but from the position on the quark it looks infinite because if you scale speed to the environment and you try to make it to the edge you never will.
Click to expand...

Prove it to me, our universe could have had an infinite amount of big bangs and after each it takes billions of years to reach the point where another big bang can happen. The fact is, if you agree that our universe is infinite everything is possible.

You quite obviously believe that our universe is the one and only universe and that the big bang is the start of it all, you could be correct however I would suggest that we're not that special.

You say about a balloon, it expands yes I agree but answer me this what keeps the balloon from collapsing in on itself?
 
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I didn't say it couldn't collapse in on itself and I never denied that there couldn't be more than one universe. We are arguing time relative to our universe as a physical concept and not an abstract. If we are arguing time as an abstract, as in a length or flow of events in a meta-space or concept then it is possible that it has been infinite, but if we are arguing time as a physical attribute of the universe it is not infinite it is finite because our universe was created, commonly accepted by science, the Big Bang and has boundaries. Now what are you arguing?

Edit: Also if you are conceding to the idea that the universe could collapse in on itself then you are also conceding to the idea that the universe is infinite, because how could something infinitely large collapse in on itself? If it did collapse in on itself wouldn't it take an infinite long time? Meaning that, in practice, it would never collapse in on itself?
 
Emperor_Nero said:
I didn't say it couldn't collapse in on itself and I never denied that there couldn't be more than one universe. We are arguing time relative to our universe as a physical concept and not an abstract. If we are arguing time as an abstract, as in a length or flow of events in a meta-space or concept then it is possible that it has been infinite, but if we are arguing time as a physical attribute of the universe it is not infinite it is finite because our universe was created, commonly accepted by science, the Big Bang and has boundaries. Now what are you arguing?
Click to expand...

I think the big bang is a plausible idea. That being said we shouldn't just agree with it, there is after all, an infinite amount of possibilities.

Emperor_Nero said:
Edit: Also if you are conceding to the idea that the universe could collapse in on itself then you are also conceding to the idea that the universe is infinite, because how could something infinitely large collapse in on itself? If it did collapse in on itself wouldn't it take an infinite long time? Meaning that, in practice, it would never collapse in on itself?
Click to expand...

The point to infinity is that, if our infinite universe did collapse in on itself, it would take an infinite amount of time.
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
2 4 6 8
both of those sequences are infinite yet one is quite obviously shorter. Infinity - Infinity = Infinity. So a collapsing universe is still of an infinite size. So I can happily say that our universe can collapse in on itself. Infact I would say, it supports my argument of an infinite amount of PHYSICAL time. Which do you prefer? The idea that our universe was born out of another universe, or our infinite universe took an infinite amount of time to collapse into the big bang?
 
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matt_sells said:
I think the big bang is a plausible idea. That being said we shouldn't just agree with it, there is after all, an infinite amount of possibilities.



The point to infinity is that, if our infinite universe did collapse in on itself, it would take an infinite amount of time.
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
2 4 6 8
both of those sequences are infinite yet one is quite obviously shorter. Infinity - Infinity = Infinity. So a collapsing universe is still of an infinite size. So I can happily say that our universe can collapse in on itself. Infact I would say, it supports my argument of an infinite amount of PHYSICAL time. Which do you prefer? The idea that our universe was born out of another universe, or our infinite universe took an infinite amount of time to collapse into the big bang?
Click to expand...

The universe isn't infinite though, they're finite bounds to the universe. You are contradicting your points by saying the universe is infinite and saying our universe was born out of the collapsing of another universe. If it takes an infinite amount of time to collapse if the universe was infinite then it would never collapse to give birth to another universe, therefore dispelling any points that the universe was born out of another universe. The universe can either collapse to give birth to another universe or it can be infinite, but it can't do both at the same time using your logic.

but this has gone too far off track now. Time, under prevalent and mostly mathematically proven science, cannot be infinite.

On topic: Man created a measurement for the idea of time, but it did not create the physical attribute of time.
 
What do you believe happens when time ends since you say it isnt infinite? Are there any theories on this? Also what could cause time to end? The same thing that caused it to start, but reverse?
 
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You can't simply agree or disagree.

Time is not created by man, but people became aware of it.
 
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thatguy1234 said:
What do you believe happens when time ends since you say it isnt infinite? Are there any theories on this? Also what could cause time to end? The same thing that caused it to start, but reverse?
Click to expand...


Hawking-Penrose theory is one of the theories that says time isn't infinite.

Time in relation to our universe isn't unbounded, it is obvious that it has a bound at one end. Time, as we know it, does not extend before the big bang.

Also time isn't a human perception, time is a physical attribute of the universe. It just is. The measurement of time is a human thing, but time isn't.
 
Emperor_Nero said:
Hawking-Penrose theory is one of the theories that says time isn't infinite.

Time in relation to our universe isn't unbounded, it is obvious that it has a bound at one end. Time, as we know it, does not extend before the big bang.

Also time isn't a human perception, time is a physical attribute of the universe. It just is. The measurement of time is a human thing, but time isn't.
Click to expand...

This is what i was arguing earlier lol. I didnt mean in relation to our universe either, i meant in general. For example something couldve existed before our universe. Therefore time existed before our universe.
 
We did not make time we simply percieve it.

We have and still use the Sun to determine time, I do not see any possible way that Man could have 'Created time'.
 
Well, I believe that Time is nothing but a convention made by man, for organization. Time has always been there, i mean, Time, would be like, Since the Big Bang ( not debating on this, but thought id use this as saying the creation of the universe ) the seconds, or minutes, or days the universe has gotten older. How we use Time in our lives is just divisions of it into years into months weeks days hours minutes seconds miliseconds and so on. We use Time to keep track of things. For example, we know At xyz time, the sun will rise, so we have daylight, and we know till what time will the sun be up, in that particular place, so we know how long will the daylight last, knowing all this, we can distribute our work into organized manner and can work in daylight, rest in night. Its all conventional.
Answering your question,
Did man create time? : Depends on the definition we choose to use of time, if its the measurement of days or months or years the universe has been in existance, then no, but if its the convention used by us , for dividing a day into 24 hrs, an hr into 60 minutes, a minute into 60 seconds etc, then yes.
 
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Time existed at no start point. There is no starting and no ending of time. Even after our universe dies out, time will still be there.

It is a thing of another dimension which affects our current universe. Imagine if that other dimension didn't exist, we would be living in a timeless universe. Not sure how that would work out.. but then again, that's the problem for God to solve... Perhaps it's already been solved and just waiting for us to discover it.
 
This thread has hurt my head, time to watch some Jerry springer.

OT: In my opinion we discovered time as people aged and died before we knew anything about it.
 
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