SRR - Offsite Offenses

[Threag]

Offsite scammers are a potential risk for Sythe users so why should you let them use this market place?

I know it's none of Sythe's business what has happened or happens on other forums, but if you know someone is capable of scamming and has scammed why would you take the risk?

As for other (no major) offenses, if it didn't happen here I don't think they should be punished for this BY Sythe.Org.

 

[malakadang]

Lol at people comparing scamming to murder. Seriously...?

Scamming at most is petty theft, and if you think a petty thief can't change, then you're obviously as dumb as a bag of hammers.

No one is saying a petty thief can't change, in fact, the very reason for the existence of this 'statute of limitations' is to acknowledge the very fact that they can change!

I am strongly of the belief, that what happens before them joining Sythe shouldn't be considered at all.

Serious question, why? If we would ban someone for scamming here, why would we let someone, who we know has scammed, here? It's nonsensical to give someone membership when they have committed an offence that would result in the very revocation of that membership.

And anything that happens on Sythe after a certain amount of time shouldn't be considered either. If some kid self-vouched like 2 years ago, and was trusted and is active in the community, then obviously he shouldn't be banned, people change.

What if they were not trusted and active in the community?
You would not punish all rule-breakers? It seems you do not believe in the rule of law.

If someone scams off-site while on Sythe on the otherhand, then he should get a ban.

Why? This is special pleading unless you can justify it.

 

[FireZ]

If we remove the rule altogether including scamming...I cant and wont support that, EVER.

Actually I will veto that poll option as its not in the best interest of this site, and if I am overruled thats fine but at least I can sleep at night knowing I didnt turn this place into scammers heaven.

 

[alsoforgotmyusernamenpass]

Thing is we've had people who've come banned from other sites onto Sythe and be the most amazing trustworthy people, not people who you'd have thought scammed 10m 4 years+ ago or did that silly "I'm ex jagex-staff I can give you anything you want" shit. Thusforth there should be some sort of 2 year grace period where if the ban is really old they should be given a chance here. If scammers on Sythe are eligible for a pardon upon reimbursement we can't just say "You scammed 4 years ago, keep the fuck away from our site" when they COULD of changed.

However any sort of black hat activity within the last couple of years is just unacceptable. Many people on here have researched ddosing at the very least before, however much less go through with actually doing it, so there needs to be further leniency in that aspect. I personally won't mind if it's left as it is nonetheless.

 

[ABeeCDee]

I voted remove after 2 years. DO NOT include blackhat.
Black hat should always be ban.
Rest of it, people mature and grow up. Realize what they did. Especially in that amount of time. Removing it all together though? That's stupid. One site after another.

 

[FloydZeppelin]

Every situation should be weighed and judged accordingly.

People who show current (Yes current is 2011 as well...) interest in scamming and/or black-hat activities should be outright banned no exception, then if they were to pardon 6 months later, they could be evaluated and again judged accordingly (Real world thieves CAN be incorporated back into society, but giving too much rope can just create relapse).

Also the offense should be weighed. There's definitely a difference between someone who shows extreme interest in RATs and some dumb kid who pays a few bucks for a phishing set-up or something. I say this only because people who do stuff like rat/key-logging also have a pretty good sense of manipulation, they're pioneers in the art of deception, they know how to talk, which in my opinion just destroys your character all together... These people gotta go. To be honest, if they're currently involved in it, I wouldn't be letting them back for a very... VERY long time. You got caught red-handed.

On the other hand, the dumb kid who paid for a phishing site doesn't really have to have much knowledge aside from advertising the site. The creator of the phisher did the deceptive work, the dumb kid just paid for it and has to do the easy part. Dumb kid SHOULD definitely be punished, but say if in 6 months they have something to show about their character, I could possibly see them be integrated back in the site.

Bottom line, if you do the crime you SHOULD do the time. It should all just be weighed though.

Edit: When I say current by the way, I mean in the past 4-5 years seems current. I also believe that if you have a background, if you've scammed/phished/hacked etc., and EVEN IF YOU HAVE CHANGED, you should still make your crimes public and be punished accordingly. There's just something about being caught red-handed by someone else that deters every ounce of resourcefulness and sincerity...

Not to mention, even if you think your scam back in the day was petty, it wasn't - and if you're truly sorry you won't have any problem coming forward. You can't just sweep something under the rug and pretend like it never happened, YOU DESERVE TO BE PUNISHED FOR IT, just like that person was punished in a way when you snatched their geepee.

 

[Nerfed]

To be honest i dont really care what people do on other forumns, it should be there behavior on this forum that counts.

 

[FloydZeppelin]

To be honest i dont really care what people do on other forumns, it should be there behavior on this forum that counts.

Yikes, and what makes you think that someone won't do something to you? Because the forum names are different? Sorry bud, they're scammers and the internet is their prey. I hope you don't really believe that because you might not have an easy time here. And to be honest it's people with those kind of attitudes that get scammed more often.

 

[SuF]

If we remove the rule altogether including scamming...I cant and wont support that, EVER.

Actually I will veto that poll option as its not in the best interest of this site, and if I am overruled thats fine but at least I can sleep at night knowing I didnt turn this place into scammers heaven.

Just do everything besides scamming. Nothing else is really all that important.

 

[rue]

The purpose of the stature of limits is to ban people who have committed an offense within the constraints of that SoL. Not to watch their every move for the duration.

That was a figure of speech that I didn't bother to clarify, sorry n4no.

 

[Khroniik]

Honestly, people do change. In a market that specifically targets the teenage demographic, a lot of stupid mistakes are made due to the inexperience of the user base. Because of this, I would think that a complete dis-allowance of those who have screwed up in the past doesn't make total and complete sense, as that would limit the potential of the Sythe community in terms of total number of active users, as well as total activity in the market.

That being said, many people are just born to be assholes. Some of those who have scammed in the past on other sites will simply look at Sythe as another temporary base from which to operate user-interactions with solely negative attention.

The most logical solution, as it seems to me, is to follow a policy of forgiveness to those who have scammed offsite, so long as such nefarious activities transpired more than two years ago. On that note, I also would like to support the notion suggested previously, giving all known past-scammers a TWC until they prove themselves to be valuable and trustworthy members of the Sythe community.

As far as Blackhats go, the policy should be the opposite. To have the skill set necessary to become anything resembling a blackhat takes time and dedication that far outway the temporary temptations a scammer might decide to indulge on a whim. The fact that anyone learns the skillset necessary to hack/engineer anyone with such negative intentions should be taken as an insight into the character of the individual.

TL;DR: Scammers should be allowed a TWC two years after any off-site scamming. Screw blackhats.

 

[Desir0]

Black-Hat and scamming should always be a ban like someone said up.
Tolerate any activity in that kind will change sythe at all believe me, that must be not allowed.. Just my point of view

 

[malakadang]

Just do everything besides scamming. Nothing else is really all that important.

I'm sure certain forms of black-hat are; unless you would lump them in the same category as scamming. Even still, if we punish say DDoSing 'onsite', we should punish it if someone does it 'offsite'.

 

IMO what the fuck does offsite have anything to do with this site? Feels like a power trip to me honestly.

 

[FloydZeppelin]

IMO what the fuck does offsite have anything to do with this site? Feels like a power trip to me honestly.

On-site, off-site, on forum x; or forum y - You're still the same person. It has everything the fuck to do with this forum because it's your character that's being taken into question. In no way would I consider it a "power trip".

 

[malakadang]

IMO what the fuck does offsite have anything to do with this site? Feels like a power trip to me honestly.

Why do you think scamming is against the rules? Because we don't want scammers on Sythe. That's what offsite activities have to do with this site.

 

[n4n0]

Thread has been dead for 3 days and we have a tie in the voting. I'm going to close this and remake it with the top 3 options and the final decision will be made from the results of that vote. Closing this for now, ill make the new one when I get home.