[Resolved]

*To Staff, please let me know if gyazo isn't acceptable, and I will manually create imgur's for each picture*
http://www.sythe.org/members/326450-playerauctions.html

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TLDR:
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1) I purchase an Account on Player Auctions with an Insurance Policy (Claiming you get refunded if the account is recovered)
2) The Account is Recovered
3) Player Auctions asks for proof that the account is recovered.
4) I provide that exact proof: https://i.gyazo.com/0eec636854052e2b268611956249e68f.png
5) I Don't get my refund
6) I get banned on Player Auctions
7) The Original seller (who recovered the account) is still selling on Player Auctions

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Really Long Please Read (RLPR):
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Player Auctions believes they can scam whoever they want, and get away with it without repercussion. One issue, I’m not your typical customer. I refuse to roll over and accept what Player Auctions has done to me, and others. I won’t just give up, I’m determined to get as much publicity as possible on the unethical actions that Player Auctions conducts on a daily basis.

A few links of interest:
Player Auctions Better Business Bureau reports:
http://www.checkbca.org/report/playerauctionscom-100079280/complaints
SiteJabber, includes numerous horror stories:
http://www.sitejabber.com/reviews/www.playerauctions.com

This is so far beyond money at this point, I have devoted a good portion of my free time to exposing this story. Just to be clear with my intentions, I hope to hit Player Auctions where it hurts most… their bottom line dollar. In doing so, saving numerous customers the horror’s of dealing with an unethical company offering fraudulent services. I have already begun counter advertising against Player Auctions on two other Runescape Marketplace websites. I’m prepared to take this further than anyone else has taken it.

Before this crook gives some twisted response, as Player Auctions always so craftily does, I ask you to read over the details, and the screenshots. Do I not deserve compensation for my loses?

For transparency sake, if Player Auctions does issue a refund it is only because I’ve gotten so vocal about this case. There are hundreds of other customers that have been taken by their false claims and fraudulent services.


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12/03/2015:
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Player Auctions:
Asks for proof in the form of communication with the game developer that the account was recovered.
https://i.gyazo.com/877d50cb01515dfa6b08dc3a61f1e6b5.png

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12/07/2015:
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Customer:
Sends proof from Jagex that the account was reclaimed to player auctions.
https://i.gyazo.com/b1a83ed5eaec9672577b134ac1a4f39f.png
http://i.imgur.com/pJFv27c.png

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12/08/2015:
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Player Auctions:
Claims that the information provided isn’t sufficient enough.
https://i.gyazo.com/0994bf22cffa28b5c9043e3e9072df93.png
Customer Response:
Shows that the account was successfully transferred to my email, that I had two factor authentication on android cell phone, and that I was not notified of an email change. In this case there is absolutely no other option other than the original owner recovering.
https://i.gyazo.com/c9442d5984c7df9218dd4962e194568a.png



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12/09/2015:
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Player Auctions:
Asks if I have access to the recovery questions.
https://i.gyazo.com/9665480acd02c6d31d886f68f9c26a39.png
Customer response:
Recovery questions didn’t exist on this account I purchased, and are no longer a standard part
of the runescape recovery process.
https://i.gyazo.com/06307b7a9cae32a1b68c1e0699524503.png




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12/15/2015:
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Customer:
Questioning why Player Auctions has taken over 5 days (in breach of their own contract), and demands a response
https://i.gyazo.com/8d3aab6607ca83a31a5e211cdb2ec30f.png




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12/16/2015:
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Player Auctions:
Says the evidence I provided is Not sufficient.
https://i.gyazo.com/bdba6e3da0604d88f27c4801400e55e5.png
Customer Response:
Pleads that my evidence is sufficient, and begs Player Auctions to provide direction in what they are looking for.
https://i.gyazo.com/b4b0993de87a9958e941e9192c1fb25f.png

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12/17/2015:
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Player Auctions:
Once again deflects my evidence, despite my attempts to reason.
https://i.gyazo.com/884e5c00a25aca77e630f19d4a7097e5.png
Customer Response:
Once again run through the evidence, and answering all of Player Auctions Questions
https://i.gyazo.com/d10dd3c6ecfde776141131711434f94a.png











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12/21/2015:
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Player Auctions:
Insinuates that I changed the email myself, and am trying to request a refund.
https://i.gyazo.com/3ae871fc7a806e8f420b6d8c6eb37061.png
Customer Response:
Calls Player Auctions out for how fraudulent their services are, and shoots down some locked account theory they have.
https://i.gyazo.com/a97f54db0af6e798d562ce7cfa77ec6c.png
Notes:
I thought I was the one being covered by their insurance here? Why am I being made out to be the potential criminal!!!


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12/24/2015:
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Player Auctions:
Once again declines my evidence.
https://i.gyazo.com/4d6bd4456104da44dcfc81f6b7f47783.png
Notes:
I thought I was the one being covered by their insurance here? Why am I being made out to be the potential criminal!!!


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12/25/2015: THE BIG DAY!!!!!
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Customer:
Jagex explicitly states clear as day, that the account was INDEED RECOVERED.
Bingo, headshoot, triple kill. Mic drop x 50000. This is it, there is no dispute. This is the real deal.
https://i.gyazo.com/4dd78496850b711e3fc747972e208a51.png
https://i.gyazo.com/0eec636854052e2b268611956249e68f.png

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12/27/2015:
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Customer:
Asks for Update on the newly submitted information
https://i.gyazo.com/64dce7a1d4c72281d0a567dd90bd8b6a.png


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12/28/2015:
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Customer:
Asks for Update on the newly submitted information
https://i.gyazo.com/d266685ac2a4ee7d56f788b749b0b4bc.png

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12/30/2015:
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Customer:
Asks for Update on the newly submitted information. And includes the screenshots once again
https://i.gyazo.com/84603a6cca309a8b1c9cd7912bd83607.png
Note: PLAYER AUCTIONS IS OUT OF COMPLIANCE AT THIS POINT.
They guarantee a 5 day turnaround on messages.
https://i.gyazo.com/e55c2f92e0613f0fe075eb279560c8d8.png

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12/31/2015:
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Customer:
Asks for Update on the newly submitted information
https://i.gyazo.com/f26961ec4f7a8e7c3d8d734b3e04c28b.png

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1/1/2015:
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Customer:
Asks for Update on the newly submitted information
https://i.gyazo.com/23a2af5c2cef2df0330a65d36ba6bb24.png

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1/4/2015:
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Customer:
Asks for Update on the newly submitted information, and threatens to go public with this ordeal
https://i.gyazo.com/9927b52dc26134f5a267f478894160f6.png

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1/6/2015:
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Customer:
Issues Paypal Claim, as Player Auctions was out of compliance and I had limited time to file the Claim.

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1/12/2015:
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Player Auctions:
1)Claims to have been away on the holidays, and apologizes for the long response time.
https://i.gyazo.com/28485be4310f59d286f9862bc792ee9d.png
2) Suspends my account on player Auctions:
https://i.gyazo.com/e21a3a9fda1dfa89f11e9f45550434bd.png
Notes:
This is unacceptable as they clearly have listed a 5 day turn around in their agreement. This is WAY past our agreement. I’d normally be ok with the delay, however Player Auctions lives by their documentation/terms. It’s only fair that I expect them to do the same with their guaranteed 5 day response time.


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IN THE END:
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- The Guy who recovered his account is STILL SELLING ON PLAYER AUCTIONS
- I’m banned
- I don’t get a refund

 

Confirming that OP was in fact scammed by the website www.playerauctions.com. I would advise everyone to stay away from this website as it is clear they have no interest in doing legitimate business and are only interested in scamming their customers. This is very disheartening as I and many others once held PlayerAuctions in high regard.

In the interest of visibility and for the safety of everyone, I will be making a sticky for all account-trading subforums referencing this report and declaring www.playerauctions.com to be a scamming company.

I won't be banning the playerauctions sythe account as that account only serves to reply to posts like this and doesn't actually do any trading. The user who runs the PA sythe account, Jacob, is actually quite a helpful guy and has resolved sythe user's issues with PA in the past. I hope he will be able to do the same for OP here, in the mean time, I am spreading the word so that others do not experience the same horror story you have

 

Hey guys,

This issue has now been resolved.

I can safely say, that items like this are by no means, the "norm" for PA, despite there being reports here or there of problematic orders, the truth is, the vast majority (97% of what we process) goes on to successful closure with both parties leaving positive feedback for each other.

This issue unfortunately, had a few hiccups which I can explain.

1) There was indeed a delay in PA's correspondence. Firstly because of increased order activity in December, and during the latter part of the issue, because the case-handler had gone on holiday.

On this particular issue, we take responsibility for, because we did not appropriately set the member's expectations (by saying there would be a delay, and turning on holiday notices). I have an action item for this which I'll address below.

2) One item which caused a delay for this investigation was a discrepancy in the order confirmation page. KnowYourEnemy forgot to include his answers but here they are: :noworry:



By stating he had the recovery questions, this begs the question in our investigative process if a user has lost access to the account by his own fault (in which case recovery questions are useless). If he has these recovery tools, why can't he recover it himself. We then need to determine that it is indeed the fault of the seller.

3) KnowYourEnemy filed a dispute with PayPal on Dec 21 (something that was left out in the history), and escalated it to a claim on Jan 6th. This is what resulted in the account suspension.

The account suspension has nothing to do with "You've sent too many emails, you bother us, and we don't want to refund you". Many of you know us, and even pointed out that we have celebrated our 15 year anniversary last year. There is NO WAY we would have survived -in this industry- by playing the shady robber.

It is even more silly to think that we want to scam a member like KnowYourEnemy who has been with us since 2011, and has a solid trading history with us. There is NO LOGICAL SENSE at all, in thinking that we meant to defraud him. On the contrary, we think Joseph is awesome (which we will get to later).

The suspension occurred as a result of an automated system process which automatically shuts down accounts when suspected payment fraud occurs (a chargeback), this is done to prevent any further "bad orders" from being placed and opening up further liability. It is a defense mechanism and nothing more.

The suspension is clearly documented on our site... especially as it pertains to open account investigations :idea: :

4) The actual results of the investigation: We decided in KnowYourEnemy's favor.

According to his timeline, we responded on Jan 12. A positive decision was made on Jan 13 with a coupon code created and sent to his account. Unfortunately... his account was blocked from receiving the insurance code... because of the suspension. PayPal eventually decided in our favor.

A robber would have left it at that.

What did PlayerAuctions do?

We unsuspended KnowYourEnemy's account, and sent him the Market Credit insurance code on Feb 15th after the PayPal chargeback case was closed (this was even 8 days before I managed to get back on to Sythe and see the issue... so... our system works in favor of good members, even without my intervention)

The seller was also suspended on December 8th and no longer active on the PA platform.

Final Thoughts:

Game account reclamations & insurance are a very sensitive item for our business. First... because we want to provide the best assurance to our member base possible... that if something goes wrong, we'll be there for them in good faith. At the same time, the very same system is used and abused by various and sundry people who (try to) fake evidence, or use cunning and collusion to come out on top.

So it is a delicate balance between protecting members, and protecting ourselves.

What PA Could have Done Better, and Will Improve:
We could have been better at appropriately setting the users expectations when we were gone on holiday. With one GAR specialist on hand, this point proves (especially during increased volume/holiday seasons) that one case handler is not enough. I will be on-boarding another individual for the Marketplace team to help reduce wait times. I've also spoken with team members about holiday-notices when people do need to take off, so that open cases will know what is up.

I offer an apology for this to KnowYourEnemy for us failing in this regard. Since 2013, we have grown by more than 60%, while still maintain very lean operations (there are only 50 of us who run and manage the entire PA platform), it may be time to on board a few more resources.

KnowYourEnemy's Stake in All This:
Some people who complain... are actually very much entirely at fault and just think that huffing and puffing will get them what they want. I am not one of those people who believe the "customer is always right". But I do believe that a deep understanding of people and their motivations is very important. And I will say that if I were in KnowYourEnemy's shoes, I probably would have done the same thing, and I am perfectly contented to believe that he did -not- at all intend to cause an unnecessary ruckus. We are with him on this issue, and openly appreciate him sticking with us for more than 5 years.

So despite my response it is provided ONLY to give greater insight into the matter, and by no means are meant to disparage KnowYourEnemy at all. I will be the first to say that he is above reproach in this matter.

Take-aways for the Sythe Community:
Do not... under any circumstance, get trigger happy with issues disputes, claims, or chargebacks with payment processors... ESPECIALLY if an ongoing case is still open. One thing, that I looked into is that KnowYourEnemy was in contact only with Shawn during this time and did not (to our knowledge) visit our LiveChat to see what's up (they do appropriate escalations, if for example... your email gets relegated to a spam folder or something, they are happy to let other departments know if we have exceeded our response times).

At the end of the day, doing a CB always causes problems and complicates things, and not just for the order at hand. One of the very unique things about PlayerAUctions, is that our risk management system is tied into third party international fraud prevention systems, so if a CB occurs, our system automatically reports this to 3rd party risk systems (its in our privacy policy).

My final message is... please believe us when we say that PA is here... not just to take a commission off your trades... but we believe more in the rights of gamers to be free to trade their digital assets. This is more about gamer's rights, than it is about "doing business". PA started 15 years ago with this premise, and we've been reinforcing it ever since.

We mean to do you good, and it's better to give the benefit of the doubt... than to scream fire/scammer at your nearest forum. We're here for you, and will always be.

Cheers,
Jacob :love: