Macbook Pro VS. PC Laptop

[WzdsRS]

Hey everyone...
I'm a soon to be college student looking to buy a laptop for college.

Before I get into the details: I DO NOT CARE ABOUT YOUR BIAS BULLSHIT. KEEP IT OFF THE THREAD.

I'm planning on either a degree in Engineering or Veterinary, with a slight possibility of Radiology (16 year medical degree).
I am looking for a laptop that can last me 4 years or more.
I am looking for a laptop that will be secure, have few-to-no hardware issues.
I want it to have an array of software choices: pertaining mainly to engineering fields or science fields.
I want functionality to be simple, fast, and effective.

Here is what I do in my spare time in regards to computers;
Browse the web
Write some code
Manage website
Occasionally play a game (something small like minecraft)
Write documents
Create *some* graphics

I don't mind costs if the functionality is there, but I need to know if I should bother looking into the Macbook for the fields I'm interested in.

From what I understand, Macs are notoriously aimed at Science and Engineering majors, but I'm open to a PC.
I'd prefer a responsible discussion as for the pros and cons of both computers, rather than someone screaming bloody murder as to why they hate one or the other.


My main fears as of now: I'll spend too much and be unhappy with the computer a year from now. The computer (especially PCs) will be notorious for hardware incompatibility issues.

 

[mage3158]

From what I understand, Macs are notoriously aimed at Science and Engineering majors, but I'm open to a PC.

Wrong, most engineering, science and math things are focused in windows or linux (or all 3).

I recommend investing in a well rated pc laptop, since the equivalent mac is probably a lot more money for no benefits. And macs go the same way as PCes usually: keyboards, discdrives, etc... it's unavoidable on a long enough timeline no matter who makes it.

 

[WzdsRS]

http://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/performance-retina/

They seem to be targeting video/graphics editors and creators as well as Scientists and Engineers here. That's where I have a hard time believing they'd advertise themselves to a specific group, rather than to an average person like my mother, who just likes to use a computer whenever.

I'd agree--slightly--with the hardware matter. Hardware will eventually fail. That brings up another question...

Is a software that's made for SPECIFIC hardware better, more stable, than software that is just made for an OS with lots of hardware combinations?
For example, the iPhone runs iOS, so everything works specifically for its set of hardware, whereas Android has to adapt based on phone companies wanting to use different hardwares?

 

[mage3158]

Is a software that's made for SPECIFIC hardware better, more stable, than software that is just made for an OS with lots of hardware combinations?
For example, the iPhone runs iOS, so everything works specifically for its set of hardware, whereas Android has to adapt based on phone companies wanting to use different hardwares?

All laptop and desktop processors are based on x86 architecture, so the reason apple uses only specific hardware components is simply to be a proprietary OS, making it very difficult to use it on hardware they didn't put out.
So no, it's not more stable.

And, in general, the things that can have issues (graphics cards, sound cards, etc) all have their own drivers.

 

[They be trippin]

All it is saying is that you'll have a optional 16GB of RAM (which will be in a more expensive model.) You can get that as well on PC. They're just playing you with that one.

 

[risk it nerd]

http://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/performance-retina/

They seem to be targeting video/graphics editors and creators as well as Scientists and Engineers here. That's where I have a hard time believing they'd advertise themselves to a specific group, rather than to an average person like my mother, who just likes to use a computer whenever.

I'd agree--slightly--with the hardware matter. Hardware will eventually fail. That brings up another question...

Is a software that's made for SPECIFIC hardware better, more stable, than software that is just made for an OS with lots of hardware combinations?
For example, the iPhone runs iOS, so everything works specifically for its set of hardware, whereas Android has to adapt based on phone companies wanting to use different hardwares?

Agreed! Macs are NOT ment for anything else than editing and portability, probably light gaming, but even in what they are made for, they lack power! so for example, here is what you are most likely getting in a Macbook Pro 15-inch non retina ($1799):-
2.3GHz Quad-core Intel Core i7, Turbo Boost up to 3.3GHz
4GB 1600MHz DDR3 SDRAM - 2x2GB
500GB Serial ATA Drive @ 5400 rpm
SuperDrive 8x (DVD±R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)
MacBook Pro 15-inch Glossy Widescreen Display

But look at what you can get with a laptop from XoticPC:-
- 3rd Generation Intel® Ivy Bridge Core™ i7-3840QM (2.8GHz - 3.8GHz, 8MB Intel® Smart Cache, 45W Max TDP) beat that? I bet even the most expensive Macbook Pro will not beat this CPU.
nVidia GeForce GTX 670MX 3,072MB PCI-Express GDDR5 DX11 with Optimus™ Technology [User Upgradeable] Beat this? nope, you can't! I know you're not a gamer, but it's future-proof, included in price and has CUDA which helps in Photoshop, Premiere and After Effects.
16GB - DDR3 1600MHz Dual Channel Memory (4 SODIMMS) 16GB, 1600Mhz, that's alot!
750GB 7200RPM [Serial-ATA II 300 - 16MB Cache] normal 750GB 7200RPM ( I hear macs use 5400RPM)
128GB Crucial M4 Series Solid State Drive [SSD2 Serial-ATA III] 128GB SSD? boot as fast as possible!
everything else is the same.
http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np9170...em-p-4342.html?wconfigure=yes&change_view=rbm
The only downside is weight..

 

[WzdsRS]

Alright, so you're saying look around more? I've owned a few laptops so far, and the three I have had, have all had issues.

I've had an HP, and Alienware, and an Acer. All three had issues with the NICs and CPU overheating. I've yet to own a MAC, so I don't know if the issues are the same kind of thing.

I'd like to hear more!

 

[mage3158]

My brother owns a mac book pro, let me shake off a few issues it has had:

- Overheating
- Hard drive failure
- Inability to boot
- Crash loops
- Broken keys
- Faulty disc drive

Macs are far from flawless.

With that said, if you're still interested... you can install the mac OS on several laptops through various methods, because many laptops have similar hardware.

http://www.macbreaker.com/2012/09/best-hackintosh-laptops-2012-mountain-lion.html

http://www.hackintosh.com/

 

[RuneScapeJJ]

I would definately go with Windows to make sure you can use all programs.

1920x1080 screen
i7 ivy bridge series processor
630m+ videocard

Get it from a good brand my personal experiences with ASUS are good.
I own an Asus N56VZ with a 256GB SSD, it's beastly and extremely silent when not using the dedicated graphics. Cost me 1100€ so I assume you can get it in the US for like 1100$ as prices seem to be the same in dollars.

There also is a slimmer variant that sports the same specs.

asus zenbook ux51vz
http://www.laptopmag.com/review/laptops/asus-zenbook-ux51vz-dh71.aspx

With a quad-core Core i7 processor, blazing-fast SSDs and a powerful Nvidia GPU, the $1,949 ASUS Zenbook UX51V packs a ton of power into a slim and portable frame. While we wished the 15-inch screen supported touch, we appreciate the full HD resolution and wide viewing angles. This Ultrabook also lasts almost 6 hours on a charge and boasts excellent speakers. We just wish the UX51V ran cooler when playing games.

Ultimately, the UX51V's most direct competitor is the 15-inch MacBook Pro with Retina Display. Apple's machine sports a sharper and brighter screen and much longer battery life in a slightly lighter design, but it also costs $250 more. Plus, the game selection for Mac, while improving, trails Windows. Bottom line: The ASUS UX51V isn't just a great MacBook Pro alternative; it's one of the best premium 15-inch Ultrabooks yet.

 

[WzdsRS]

Here is another thing I forgot to mention.
I will be bringing a relatively powerful Windows desktop PC with me. The laptop will just be for out of the dorm room use.

Does that change anything? Thanks JJ, I'll look into it.

 

[xDePloY]

For the electives/subjects your choosing I would go for the Laptop; MacbookPro is mostly used for urban development and design. It is pretty pointless if your not doing sorta subjects because its better supported on that platform. Also I think Macs are usually aimed to last 2 years before something happens. My brother had to fully replace his internal hardrives and batteries sine they were burnt out. He actually rarely used them; but all in favour in regard of your subjects wise and what your looking for; I would highly recommend a windows computer/laptop.

 

[Busta305]

If money is no object get the Macbook Pro with retina display, it is the best quality build laptop. It will do everything you asked. You can install Windows on it if you prefer Windows over OSX or just install both.

I was personally looking for a laptop myself and decided to go with the Macbook Pro retina mainly because of the high res screen and built quality, I installed Windows on it since I don't like OSX but you can have both installed to suit your needs.

 

[SASRT8]

Although I am a bit biased after having owned both a MBP and many PC laptops, here is where the facts lie in the benefits of each pertaining to what you CURRENTLY do with laptops, and what your profession will lead you to do with them in the future.

As far as the MBP goes, the only main advantage I can find is in their screen. With their outrageous resolution in the Retina models, you can render much larger images, to where it will fit on the screen pixel for pixel(without any scaling) In many large-scale engineering programs, this can be beneficial as you can fit more on the screen while also keeping the program at its maximum level of detail possible. The OS is fairly fluid, but not many engineering programs have been designed around the use of MAC OSX, and many of them that are available for mac OSX don't support the use of OpenCL or physX modeling...amongst other things. Also, you can't get a MBP with anything better than a Nvidia GT650.<-more on this later.

Where a PC *CAN* come out and shine is by picking up on the lack of support that some of the mac programs fall out on. With PC laptops you can get all the way up to a GTX680m, which is FAR more powerful than the GT650m. Now surely you're thinking" blah blah i dont need a high end graphics card, I'm not gonna play games" but GPU's go FAR beyond just rendering games these days. Simple programs like Photoshop utilize the OpenCL capabilities of the GPU to render images. Believe it or not.. Your GPU is a FAR more capable means of processing pictures and videos, and even doing renderings within your engineering programs. If the program is coded to utilize the CUDA architecture, well then the more CUDA cores your card can utilize...then the more efficiently your programs will complete the tasks you have assigned(once again, such as rendering or editing)

Where the MBP's GT650m has 384 CUDA cores(which can complete tasks roughly 4x as fast as the CPU can, some PC laptops which offer the GTX680M have 1344 CUDA cores, which allows renderings to be completed about 14x faster than the same CPU would allow. This is especially handy when dealing with mega-resolution images.

These laptops which offer the gtx680m can be had for MUCH less than the price tag of a retina-equipped MBP w/ gt650m. For the same price tag as a MBP, you can get DUAL GTX680m's by choosing a Sager laptop. Plus they're upgradeable..so you can put new graphics cards in them for years to come.

my .02 simply says avoid the macbooks for your interests and usage.

 

[Busta305]

Although I am a bit biased after having owned both a MBP and many PC laptops, here is where the facts lie in the benefits of each pertaining to what you CURRENTLY do with laptops, and what your profession will lead you to do with them in the future.

As far as the MBP goes, the only main advantage I can find is in their screen. With their outrageous resolution in the Retina models, you can render much larger images, to where it will fit on the screen pixel for pixel(without any scaling) In many large-scale engineering programs, this can be beneficial as you can fit more on the screen while also keeping the program at its maximum level of detail possible. The OS is fairly fluid, but not many engineering programs have been designed around the use of MAC OSX, and many of them that are available for mac OSX don't support the use of OpenCL or physX modeling...amongst other things. Also, you can't get a MBP with anything better than a Nvidia GT650.<-more on this later.

Where a PC *CAN* come out and shine is by picking up on the lack of support that some of the mac programs fall out on. With PC laptops you can get all the way up to a GTX680m, which is FAR more powerful than the GT650m. Now surely you're thinking" blah blah i dont need a high end graphics card, I'm not gonna play games" but GPU's go FAR beyond just rendering games these days. Simple programs like Photoshop utilize the OpenCL capabilities of the GPU to render images. Believe it or not.. Your GPU is a FAR more capable means of processing pictures and videos, and even doing renderings within your engineering programs. If the program is coded to utilize the CUDA architecture, well then the more CUDA cores your card can utilize...then the more efficiently your programs will complete the tasks you have assigned(once again, such as rendering or editing)

Where the MBP's GT650m has 384 CUDA cores(which can complete tasks roughly 4x as fast as the CPU can, some PC laptops which offer the GTX680M have 1344 CUDA cores, which allows renderings to be completed about 14x faster than the same CPU would allow. This is especially handy when dealing with mega-resolution images.

These laptops which offer the gtx680m can be had for MUCH less than the price tag of a retina-equipped MBP w/ gt650m. For the same price tag as a MBP, you can get DUAL GTX680m's by choosing a Sager laptop. Plus they're upgradeable..so you can put new graphics cards in them for years to come.

my .02 simply says avoid the macbooks for your interests and usage.

You can install Windows on MBP and the MBP with Retina has more than enough power for what he needs and better screen and design than any laptop available. If price is not a problem he should go with MBP.



To OP:
What screen size do you need and do you need it to be portable(lightweight)?

 

[WzdsRS]

13-15.6in would probably be the perfect size of screen because of its ease of portability. I had a 17.3in laptop, and that was way too big for my needs.

I'm not too worried about power, since Apple has become more and more competitive with their specs. A few years ago, that was a completely different story.

As for Windows 7 on the MBP... Is it partitioned on the hard-drive, allowing you to use both MAC OS and Windows 7? Or if I want Windows 7, would it only allow me to use that operating system?

Another thing I worry about is the reliability and features of a MBP compared to a comprable PC laptop.

 

13-15.6in would probably be the perfect size of screen because of its ease of portability. I had a 17.3in laptop, and that was way too big for my needs.

I'm not too worried about power, since Apple has become more and more competitive with their specs. A few years ago, that was a completely different story.

As for Windows 7 on the MBP... Is it partitioned on the hard-drive, allowing you to use both MAC OS and Windows 7? Or if I want Windows 7, would it only allow me to use that operating system?

Another thing I worry about is the reliability and features of a MBP compared to a comprable PC laptop.

Before we get into my reasoning, I am actually a professional. I'm a tech expert with the Canadian version of Radio Shack to pay through school, specializing in computers.

I'll make this really simple:

You will be using Windows-focused software 90% of the time for your degrees.

• You will never NEED a Mac in any degree other than something art-related
• You can install Windows on Mac, but that would be silly considering you won't need the Mac OS at all
• For what you want it for, you would literally be giving Apple free money since you wouldn't be using their product for what it was intended. Why not put your money towards something you'll use?

If you're even considering a Mac, I'm going to assume you have a high budget. Take that budget, spend it on a Lenovo laptop, and you'll be happy forever. The business-class Lenovos are the best workstation laptops (for engineering graphics etc) on the market.

And just for the record:

Alright, so you're saying look around more? I've owned a few laptops so far, and the three I have had, have all had issues.

I've had an HP, and Alienware, and an Acer. All three had issues with the NICs and CPU overheating. I've yet to own a MAC, so I don't know if the issues are the same kind of thing.

I'd like to hear more!

You've picked 3 shitty brands. ASUS and Lenovo are king, with Samsung, Sony, and Toshiba taking the best "average user" ranks.

 

[SASRT8]

You can install Windows on MBP and the MBP with Retina has more than enough power for what he needs and better screen and design than any laptop available. If price is not a problem he should go with MBP.

sure the MBP's EXTERIOR design is pretty nice. But their INTERIOR design is nothing worth mentioning. 2700 for WAY WAY WAY inferior hardware to an 2700$ pc laptop, and the cooling systems suck massive dick. Under a heavy processing load w/ the i7 in my ol MBP, the piece of shit sat around 100-102*c

My current MSI, with overall FAR superior hardware, will NEVER overheat like that.

 

[Busta305]

sure the MBP's EXTERIOR design is pretty nice. But their INTERIOR design is nothing worth mentioning. 2700 for WAY WAY WAY inferior hardware to an 2700$ pc laptop, and the cooling systems suck massive dick. Under a heavy processing load w/ the i7 in my ol MBP, the piece of shit sat around 100-102*c

My current MSI, with overall FAR superior hardware, will NEVER overheat like that.

I never had a mac before but I had no problems with new Macbook overheating or anything like that and it is actually more quite than my old notebook. And if you're going to buy a Laptop that weighs 12 pounds might as well get a desktop.

13-15.6in would probably be the perfect size of screen because of its ease of portability. I had a 17.3in laptop, and that was way too big for my needs.

I'm not too worried about power, since Apple has become more and more competitive with their specs. A few years ago, that was a completely different story.

As for Windows 7 on the MBP... Is it partitioned on the hard-drive, allowing you to use both MAC OS and Windows 7? Or if I want Windows 7, would it only allow me to use that operating system?

Another thing I worry about is the reliability and features of a MBP compared to a comprable PC laptop.

Windows 7 will be partitioned on the drive, you can choose how much space you want to assign to Windows or OSX depending on which you're planning to use more. MBP comes with all standard features, Wifi, bluetooth, etc, it doesn't come with dvd drive so that is something to note if you're going to be using discs.

If you don't choose MBP with retina I will recommend ASUS Zenbook line although they aren't much cheaper then Apple as I found out.

 

[Lord LaLa]

I have a friend who is currently doing Industrial Design at uni, and got herself a top of the line Mac Book pro to do her work on. She had the problem that all the programmes she needed were windows based and did not run on mac's, so she ended up having to add windows to the mac computer which slowed it down just so she could do her work

Best thing to do is wait till you've decided what you want to do at uni, and then find out what program's you will be using and work out then which pc is best to use for those types of things.

 

[Krzysiek23]

Well, if money is not an object, then you might as well go for the retina 15 inch MacBook Pro. The user experience of OS X is far superior to Windows in terms of everyday tasks in my opinion. Also, you could always install Windows through BootCamp (which pretty much means creating a partition) or emulate it using Parallels or VMware (might not be effective in some cases). Yes, due to generally poor heat management MacBooks might overheat (that doesn't mean damaging the CPU), although mine only gets loud while gaming.

However, if you want to go with a Windows laptop, I personally would avoid all Acers, MSIs, Asuses and especially the other unknown brands. Lenovo ThinkPads, Sony Whatever-Their-Business-Line-Is-Called and Dell Latitudes are decent ones to look at. Nonetheless, they might even cost nearly as much as the MacBook Pro if you configure them with similar specs.

O YE AND if possible, then wait for the new Intel CPUs, they're going to be released within the next ~5 months.