Immigrants.

[Weapon]

Mostly when immigrants come over, they have no sense in English at all, but they say English is the hardest language but it's only the hardest when you write English. That's why immigrants adapt to the English language because speaking it isn't hard.

 

[Finally07]

The attitude of immigrants (mostly Albanese or Moroccon) where I live is what bothers me the most. They go around beating people up in group for no reason at all, while the gang culture doesn't even exist here in Belgium. They just wanna look tough, their culture seems to be based on violence. Crime rates here in Belgium would be near zero without immigrants. These little (and also extremely dumb) thugs are the cause that my generation will vote against socialists, and especially will lose most of its tolerance. Which is a shame, because, as always, there are some good people there too.

 

[Elena]

America Is Underpopulated Compared To The Rest Of The World!

Actually I just looked it up and the united states is number 3 on the list for the MOST populated countries so I don't know why you are saying we are under populated. Only countries more populated then us are China and India.

 

[Finally07]

Actually I just looked it up and the united states is number 3 on the list for the MOST populated countries so I don't know why you are saying we are under populated. Only countries more populated then us are China and India.

You have to look at population density, total population is as relevant as milkshake regarding this matter.

USA: 179th
China: 25th
India: 33th

These last two may have an enormous population (1.3B and 1.2B respectively) but don't forget that they are also huge countries.

 

[iAGZzzz]

1/3 federal prisoners are illegal immigrants.

Illegal immigrant is cause for much crime in united states.

Illegal immigrants do not pay hospital bills and create a drain on welfare services.

Very narrow minded view. The topic is about immigrants, not illegal immigrants.

Illegal immigrant is cause for much crime in united states.

Biggest load of bollocks I've heard all day. You couldn't have generalised this sentence anymore. I think you need to do some research before throwing wild accusations like that. First thing I googled backs me up. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illega...States#Crimes_committed_by_illegal_immigrants

This example takes the example of California as it has the highest number of immigrants in the US.

I quote, "California has the largest immigrant population in the US, and immigrants (both legal and illegal) are under represented among California prison inmates. The most recent research indicates approximately 35% of the California population consists of immigrants, while immigrants represent 17% of the prison population. In fact, U.S. born adult men are incarcerated at a rate over two-and-a-half times greater than that of foreign-born men. However, this does not separate the illegal versus legal immigrants.

Illegal immigrants avoid involvement in criminal activity to reduce interaction with law enforcement officials, and according to Tim Wadsworth, an assistant professor of sociology at the University of Colorado at Boulder, "The suggestion that high levels of immigration may have been partially responsible for the drop in crime during the 1990's seems plausible."


Don't make assumptions, it can be very offensive for some people.

United states is built from immigrants.. enough said.

Well said...

 

[Xier0]

I agree with these mostly, except 8 and 9 (unless I missed another). If a country is to accept a foreign immigrant, even if they aren't an asset, they should not be a burden to the native residents.

 

[Recidivism]

-snip

Crimes committed by not penalized for and this is one state not the national average illegals are less often to be caught for a crime due to them having no ties to a community.

Most of the gang violence in America is fueled by weapons/drugs from other countries.

Illegals do not pay taxes and raise our taxes to pay for them & their anchor babies.


I also do not think an anchor baby should be considered a natural born American Citizen.

My definition of a natural born American citizen must have both of its parents be legal residents. Having an anchor baby then stealing our money to pay for it does not make you an American.


I support immigration I do not support illegal immigration or any immigrants ever getting a single cent from tax payers. It is our job to worry about ourselves if there was an illegal immigrant who needed a single penny it is unethical to steal my money to pay for him. If you want to donate your money to help them you can but do not steal my money.

 

[iAGZzzz]

Most of the gang violence in America is fueled by weapons/drugs from other countries.

Needs statistics or this is just an opinion, not a fact. I have provided statistics proving the opposite for crime, so if you really think this is the case do some reading and see if you can convince yourself first, and then use the statistics to convince us.

Illegals do not pay taxes and raise our taxes to pay for them & their anchor babies.

I cut the rest out of the quote as I didn't speak about 'anchor babies' or whatever, so stick to answering what I said seeing as you quoted me. Once again, I'm also not talking about illegal immigrants, so in future posts, let's stick to just the immigrants, as the thread and myself are discussing. Just for this post, I will answer all your statements about the illegals.

You seem to direct all your hate towards illegal immigrants, at just hearing the word 'Immigrant'. Immigrants contribute so much towards society, and you would be surprised at the % of illegal immigrants who actually contribute to society and the economy. But anyways, here's a break down of your comments once again.

1/3 federal prisoners are illegal immigrants.

Federal prisons are used for those convicted of a subset of crimes. You don't go to federal prison for robbing a bank or beating up a neighbor. You only go if the Feds had jurisdiction, which would be for a small number of crimes overall (if you are running a nationwide drug ring perhaps or killed a federal official) but would include ALL immigration crimes - since that's a federal jurisdiction.

So all people convicted FOR immigration violations would be in federal prisons, whereas very few robbers or rapists or murderers would be. It's a subset of criminals far more likely to include immigrants than the overall. Note that 70K x 5 would be about 350K Federal prison population.

The US has 2.2M people behind bars. Federal prisons are about 1/7 of that - but will include almost all illegal immigrants as they are sent to Federal prisons So chances are illegals are closer to 70K/2.2M or 3.5% of prisoners overall. I'm sure there are SOME illegals in state prisons so may be a bit more than this, however it is nowhere near the 1/3 you are trying to enforce.

Also, it's actually 27%, not 33% who are in Federal prisons. I researched it myself. Choosing the numbers of illegals in Federal prisons is being very subjective, and you're just trying to make it sounds so much worse than it actually is.

Please quote sources in the future so we can see if it is factual or just opinionated.

Illegal immigrant is cause for much crime in united states.

Once again, your statement that, "Illegal immigrant is cause for much crime in united states." is an opinion and has no factual backing, and I have provided factual backing proving the opposite. Come back with some facts please.

Illegal immigrants do not pay hospital bills and create a drain on welfare services.

One thing you should note, is it's not exactly straight forwards for an illegal to begin claiming off the state. As soon as they make their presence known, they can legally be kicked out (as long as there are not human rights issues in the way). This means the majority of illegals keep their head down and keep moving. Immigrants and illegals alike, often take on the jobs that society rejects. The low pay, low reputation jobs such as sweeping the streets. Everyone moans that they 'take our jobs' etc, but in reality, no one wanted these jobs in the first place or they wouldn't be vacant!

 

[da Vinc1]

Tighten and close the borders. Put our troops on our border not in the Middle East. Deport all the illegal immigrants.

Any discussion about immigrants is pointless without talking about race. Who would complain if most of our immigrants came from Europe? It is these immigrants that created America. But today the immigrants come from Central, and South America. They are a mixed race. We don't want them. We should kick them out whether they are legal or not. Every people and country has this right.

Japan would not allow people of a different race to take over the country why should we?
Israel would never let there be more Arabs then Jews in the 'Holy land'.

Why don't we follow this rule?

 

[Recidivism]

I cut the rest out of the quote as I didn't speak about 'anchor babies' or whatever, so stick to answering what I said seeing as you quoted me. Once again, I'm also not talking about illegal immigrants, so in future posts, let's stick to just the immigrants, as the thread and myself are discussing. Just for this post, I will answer all your statements about the illegals.

SO you chose to ignore my entire post and pick out one thing you can misrepresent?

You seem to direct all your hate towards illegal immigrants, at just hearing the word 'Immigrant'. Immigrants contribute so much towards society, and you would be surprised at the % of illegal immigrants who actually contribute to society and the economy. But anyways, here's a break down of your comments once again.

No they do not. You do realize the economic crisis we are in right now right? If we cut 100% of our budget except for our entitlement programs (yes even military cutting it) we still have a deficit.

Biggest reason for our deficit is people claiming our entitlement programs instead of working because its easier. A huge portion of our SS funds go towards anchor babies and giving free money to the woman who come to USA just to have anchor babies to steal our money.

Illegals do not pay taxes which in turn makes us have to pay higher taxes to keep paying for them it also creates an unfair advantage if they try to work for someone they could accept 30% less income and get more money.

Federal prisons are used for those convicted of a subset of crimes. You don't go to federal prison for robbing a bank or beating up a neighbor. You only go if the Feds had jurisdiction, which would be for a small number of crimes overall (if you are running a nationwide drug ring perhaps or killed a federal official) but would include ALL immigration crimes - since that's a federal jurisdiction.

Funny you claim all illegals once noticed are deported (which is not true we rarely even deport anyone anymore especially under Obama who likes illegals with their voter fraud for Dems) then you claim the reason they are arrested is immigration based offenses it can't be both ways.

The US has 2.2M people behind bars. Federal prisons are about 1/7 of that - but will include almost all illegal immigrants as they are sent to Federal prisons So chances are illegals are closer to 70K/2.2M or 3.5% of prisoners overall. I'm sure there are SOME illegals in state prisons so may be a bit more than this, however it is nowhere near the 1/3 you are trying to enforce.

I don't know where you got your math but using your numbers 1/7 of the 2.2 is 314,285 would be federal prisoners meaning over 100k in federal prisoners alone would be illegals. This is also only counting federal prisoners its hard to find statistics for non federal prisons. Illegals are much less likely to be caught for crimes as well due to having 0 ties to community. And most of the biggest gangs in USA are all from Mexico/south America

Also, it's actually 27%, not 33% who are in Federal prisons. I researched it myself. Choosing the numbers of illegals in Federal prisons is being very subjective, and you're just trying to make it sounds so much worse than it actually is.

27% was back in 2000
It is approx 35% now

It is estimated 17-22% Total Prison population total are illegal immigrants but the non federal prison numbers are a bit iffy and probably under reported

One thing you should note, is it's not exactly straight forwards for an illegal to begin claiming off the state. As soon as they make their presence known, they can legally be kicked out (as long as there are not human rights issues in the way). This means the majority of illegals keep their head down and keep moving. Immigrants and illegals alike, often take on the jobs that society rejects. The low pay, low reputation jobs such as sweeping the streets. Everyone moans that they 'take our jobs' etc, but in reality, no one wanted these jobs in the first place or they wouldn't be vacant!

Lets just say for the sake of argument we still deported anyone who was an illegal immigrant and they didn't want to draw attention.


There is an easy loophole

Step 1) Have an Anchor baby
Step 2) Free care for the child & self including food stamps
Step 3) Profit



Illegals commit voter fraud, Don't pay taxes, Commit crimes, Contribute nothing to society, ruin hospitals, steal jobs.


Ask any state in the south how well their hospitals do any state near the border has problems with illegals getting medical care and not paying bills so hospitals get shut down.



Even if our prison population was 1% illegal immigrants that is too much we don't need illegal immigration while we are in an economic crisis. The only reason illegal immigration is so rampant is because America is the biggest welfare state in the world.


Legalize all drugs, shutdown all entitlement programs then lower taxes I will accept illegal immigration but you know what they will have no incentive to come to America anymore.

 

[iAGZzzz]

- Post Above

It's getting too long and too much to spend time replying to ever little point you make but I'll bullet point my main points.

1. I chose to ignore the 'anchor baby' point and you COMPLETELY ignored my original points, and swerved the argument in the opposite direction as you had no backing.

2. Stop using "It's estimated that" and "Approximately", I've told you before and I'll tell you again, I'm dismissing every fact you state unless you can source me where you have got this information from, as you could just be making up any statistic you please.

3.

Illegals are much less likely to be caught for crimes as well due to having 0 ties to community. And most of the biggest gangs in USA are all from Mexico/south America

I'll quote this one as you must have ignored my first post.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illega...States#Crimes_committed_by_illegal_immigrants

This example takes the example of California as it has the highest number of immigrants in the US.

I quote, "California has the largest immigrant population in the US, and immigrants (both legal and illegal) are under represented among California prison inmates. The most recent research indicates approximately 35% of the California population consists of immigrants, while immigrants represent 17% of the prison population. In fact, U.S. born adult men are incarcerated at a rate over two-and-a-half times greater than that of foreign-born men. However, this does not separate the illegal versus legal immigrants.

Illegal immigrants avoid involvement in criminal activity to reduce interaction with law enforcement officials, and according to Tim Wadsworth, an assistant professor of sociology at the University of Colorado at Boulder, "The suggestion that high levels of immigration may have been partially responsible for the drop in crime during the 1990's seems plausible."

I really don't know if you actually read my posts, or just choose to ignore the bits where you have no backing. Also I want proof of your second point about the biggest gangs and where they are from. Facts and sources please.

4. Illegal immigration is a federal crime, so of course there are going to be huge numbers of illegal immigrants in Federal prisons, whether that be 27% or your "it's estimated to now be 33%". Get some statistics of the number of illegal immigrants in ALL prisons and stop choosing specific points because you have no factual backing.

In fact, I decided to do it for you: "The number of convicted criminal aliens in federal prison at the end of 2003 was 46,063; in state prisons and local jails here were 262,105" So if there are the 2.2M total prisoners back in 2003, 46,063 + 262,105 / 2,200,000 = 7.13%
Please don't say "It's estimated that it has increased from 2003", get some statistics to prove it.

Sourced from http://www.gao.gov/htext/d05646r.html

This is talking about 2003, when we both have statistics for. If you have more recent statistics, enlighten me with them, and stop estimating the figures yourself.

4. You say that "1% of illegal immigrants in prisons are already too many" Well that's why the current government are releasing them by the thousands to stop paying to maintain them in there. The current government is already doing it, so what makes the Tea party's ideas so much better?

On top of this do you seriously think that the US is the only country with immigration problems? Every country has it, some more severely than others. We wouldn't have this massive issue with illegal immigrants if we allowed people to move and live where they please, but I do agree, then not receiving the support from the government. That would be their decision.

I know the point I made is just me following idealism, and that it isn't possible at all as there would also be the illegals having the 'Free Rider' effect. I can't see a miracle solution to this or someone would have already done something. I think I'm out now, I can't argue with someone who can't see both sides of the coin or accept the areas where they have no backing. I can see and accept there are points you have made which are correct, true, and have reasoning, but I can no longer argue with someone is stubborn and just thinks everyone else is wrong.

Over and out.