Guantanamo Bay - Being shut down

[FlubbyWubs]

I would like to point out that I do like Obama, but holy hell what a mistake this is.

I am watching this on the news as I type. President Obama just signed off that Guantanamo Bay in Cuba, which holds known terrorists will be shut down within the year.

They say that the detainees being held there will come to the United States and be held in a prison here. This is a HORRIBLE idea!!! How could you bring dangerous terrorists into the country? I mean really, this is the same prison that held Sadam Hussein and several others.

This act also stops the CIA from using their methods of interrigation, which seems to be rather effective.
Well, the chaos starts.

Heres a link:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/22/us/politics/22gitmo.html

Please discuss.

 

[Shredderbeam]

The terrorists, while being held inside the U.S., will not have access to weapons. They will pose no threat to civilians.

Torture is effective, yes. So is a police state.

 

[FlubbyWubs]

Well yes. However bringing them into the country is just raising the risk of something happening.

Edit: Oh, and btw shredd, how are you . Its been a while since you've commented on one of my threads.

 

[The Riddler_]

“I believe strongly that torture is not moral, legal or effective,” he told the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence. “Any program of detention and interrogation must comply with the Geneva Conventions, the Conventions on Torture, and the Constitution. There must be clear standards for humane treatment that apply to all agencies of U.S. Government, including the Intelligence Community,” Said Barack Obama.

He's going on morals. I guess he's trying to make the US not look so much as a "bad" country. He's trying to use other ways of receiving information than torture like intense interrogation.

If it's a plot, we'll know soon enough.

 

[Analog]

Honestly, the best topic in SFA at the moment. I do see where your coming from because Guantanamo Bay, for lack of a better word, harbors some of the most notorious terrorists and prisoners know to man. One of the most notorious is KSM, otherwise known as Khalid Sheikh Mohammed; the supposed mastermind of the attacks of 9/11/01. I do disagree with your viewpoints though. They will be moved to a high security prison within the US and will have no access to any unnecessary evils. The most important factor, in the eyes of government officials, is that we can't interrogate them with torturous methods.

 

[Music Makes Me Pwn]

this is the same prison that held Osama Bin Laden and several others.

I do not think that Osama Bin Laden has yet been caught. Also, what is the difference? They will be in an even more secure prison in the states.

 

[Shroomsday]

Oh yes giving these people a fair trial is horrible idea.... If you were suspected of a crime you didn't commit - would you mind being locked up and tortured for years without a trial? There were a lot of stories about people being there that should not have been imprisoned.

Increasing Americas moral stature is really horrible idea too.

 

[FlubbyWubs]

I do not think that Osama Bin Laden has yet been caught. Also, what is the difference? They will be in an even more secure prison in the states.

Oh yeah, sorry. I mean Sadam Hussein (before he got killed). I'll fix that.
We also don't know how secure this prison will be. Obviously it will be secure, but Guantanamo Bay was crazy. They have yet to tell us which prison they will be shipped too.

Honestly, the best topic in SFA at the moment. I do see where your coming from because Guantanamo Bay, for lack of a better word, harbors some of the most notorious terrorists and prisoners know to man. One of the most notorious is KSM, otherwise known as Khalid Sheikh Mohammed; the supposed mastermind of the attacks of 9/11/01. I do disagree with your viewpoints though. They will be moved to a high security prison within the US and will have no access to any unnecessary evils. The most important factor, in the eyes of government officials, is that we can't interrogate them with torturous methods.

Thanks
And yeah, I do see where your coming from also. It all depends on where they are put. I mean I guess I didn't really think this threw before I posted. If they are in a maximum security facility then I guess it doesn't really matter. But the thought of having them in our country scares me lol.

 

[Tgump]

[17:19] Sythe: they've opened like 15 new secret bases inside the US
[17:19] Sythe: where they will continue all the programmes secretly
[17:19] Sythe: gitmo was meant to be public
[17:19] Sythe: to get the population used to the idea that if you fuck up you have your balls electrocuted

 

[Heeckeren]

[17:19] Sythe: they've opened like 15 new secret bases inside the US
[17:19] Sythe: where they will continue all the programmes secretly
[17:19] Sythe: gitmo was meant to be public
[17:19] Sythe: to get the population used to the idea that if you fuck up you have your balls electrocuted

So true ^

I think that Guantanamo Bay is WAY too known publicly. If their going to continue that shit they might as well do it in a secret place =| .

 

[Panzer]

Morals don't win wars, and they certainly don't stop terrorists from attacking

If torture gets them to talk, and if it stops them, then it should be used

 

[FlubbyWubs]

Morals don't win wars, and they certainly don't stop terrorists from attacking

If torture gets them to talk, and if it stops them, then it should be used

I agree.

But I suppose there could be other methods. Torture has been working though, there hasn't been another terrorist attack since 9/11, and throughout the whole time torture was being used.

We will see I guess.

 

[Shredderbeam]

Morals don't win wars, and they certainly don't stop terrorists from attacking

If torture gets them to talk, and if it stops them, then it should be used

Unfortunately, that is a violation of U.S. civil and international law.

 

[FlubbyWubs]

Unfortunately, that is a violation of U.S. civil and international law.

Ahh, correct.

Completely forgot about this. The reason torture was being used at GITMO was because it wasn't in the U.S. (Cuba).

So yeah, torture wont be used In the U.S., but I do feel that its going to be A LOT harder to get the terrorists to talk. If they stay at GITMO I feel we could get a lot more out of them.

I wonder what they have planned.

 

[The Fat Controller]

Ahh, correct.

Completely forgot about this. The reason torture was being used at GITMO was because it wasn't in the U.S. (Cuba).

So yeah, torture wont be used In the U.S., but I do feel that its going to be A LOT harder to get the terrorists to talk. If they stay at GITMO I feel we could get a lot more out of them.

I wonder what they have planned.

So you're saying that a good reason for the existence and continuing existence of Guantanamo Bay because it's sited in a good spot for a torture chamber. Right.

A good video:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=5H-weEBascQ

 

[FlubbyWubs]

So you're saying that a good reason for the existence and continuing existence of Guantanamo Bay because it's sited in a good spot for a torture chamber. Right.

A good video:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=5H-weEBascQ

Thats not at all what Im saying.

I don't think torture is "right" but if it works in obtaining information that could save our country from another terrorist attack, then yes torture the hell out of them.

That is what Im saying.

 

[The Fat Controller]

Thats not at all what Im saying.

I don't think torture is "right" but if it works in obtaining information that could save our country from another terrorist attack, then yes torture the hell out of them.

That is what Im saying.

Then is it also acceptable for terrorists to torture the hell out of captured Americans in an attempt to obtain information?

 

[Divine blob]

Personally, I don't think its smart. I mean seriously. If they let the terrorists out, they really must phonetap them and make sure they don't go anywhere.

 

[FlubbyWubs]

Then is it also acceptable for terrorists to torture the hell out of captured Americans in an attempt to obtain information?

Yes, absolutely.

I mean Im sure before we torture the terrorists we try to reason with them, and if that doesn't work we resort to torture. The same would apply with an American, if they don't cooperate with reason, torture might be the only option.

Personally, I don't think its smart. I mean seriously. If they let the terrorists out, they really must phonetap them and make sure they don't go anywhere.

What are you talking about? They aren't letting them go, they are just transferring them to a new facility in the U.S.

 

[TJ]

Torture is only effective if you get the truth.

And the truth varies from what you want as the truth.