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Affirmative action- your views.

  • Thread starter Thread starter Tyrone Biggums
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Tyrone Biggums

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First off, lets define Affirmative Action.
According to Wikipedia:
Affirmative action refers to policies intended to promote access to education or employment aimed at a historically socio-politically non-dominant group (typically, minorities or women). Motivation for affirmative action policies is to redress the effects of past and current discrimination and to encourage public institutions such as universities, hospitals and police forces to be more representative of the population.

This is commonly achieved through targeted recruitment programs, by preferential treatment given to applicants from socio-politically disadvantaged groups and in some cases through the use of quotas.

Opponents of affirmative action policies argue that it is based on collectivism and merely another form of discrimination because it can result in qualified applicants being denied entry to higher education or employment because they belong to a particular social group (usually the historically socio-politically dominant group; typically majority races and men, regardless of social standing or financial need.
Full article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action

Now I think it is complete bullshit. Random people who's ancestors were discriminated against are now getting compensation? For what? Being black? I could write a lot more on this, but I will just sum up my opinions. I think unless you were directly effects by the historical events causing affirmative action you shouldn't get shit. I define directly effected as an event during the time changed your life specifically. Obviously the whole thing effected everyone's lives, if it never happened things would be different somehow, but I mean directly changed your life specifically. Eg. Father being emotionally scarred or something. I recently read somewhere something about Germany trying to do something to make up to the Jews, BUT ONLY THE SURVIVORS. While I think what they are doing there is how it should be done, I also think they are assholes and waited until now when there are not many survivors left, and there probably won't be any in ten, twenty years.
 
Why should I be denied entry to a university based on the color of my skin?
 
Muffinator said:
Why should I be denied entry to a university based on the color of my skin?
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I'm not saying that, I am saying people who weren't affected at all by the actions trying to be compensated for shouldn't be compensated.
 
This (the United States) is a country where each person is the determiner of their own fate, and can make for themselves anything they choose. If you are born with a disadvantage, then the resources should be available to you (and everybody else) for you to make that up, but I'll be damned if you get favored over a better student because of your skin color.
 
Shredderbeam said:
This (the United States) is a country where each person is the determiner of their own fate, and can make for themselves anything they choose. If you are born with a disadvantage, then the resources should be available to you (and everybody else) for you to make that up, but I'll be damned if you get favored over a better student because of your skin color.
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Excatly, affrimative action doesn't help people in my eyes, sometimes you have to be knock down to get up. Everyone has the same chances here. People may not know this but companies that want to be racist and choose someone based on the gender, or skin color probably won't get far anyway and fail, because they aren't choosing the best person for the job. I would hate to lose my position to raise the diversity in the office. Also i would feel guilty if someone scored higher then me on a test and I got in because my race.
 
Shredderbeam said:
This (the United States) is a country where each person is the determiner of their own fate, and can make for themselves anything they choose. If you are born with a disadvantage, then the resources should be available to you (and everybody else) for you to make that up, but I'll be damned if you get favored over a better student because of your skin color.
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So you're saying being black is a disadvantage?
 
Tyrone Biggums said:
So you're saying being black is a disadvantage?
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No, that means if you are born in America at a disadvantage you still have the same chances everyone else has, you can still get free schooling, welfare and more. Although after a point you will control your fate, by going to school and doing good, or working hard, if you don't, you should not be considered over someone better then you because of race...
 
jaamal said:
No, that means if you are born in America at a disadvantage you still have the same chances everyone else has, you can still get free schooling, welfare and more. Although after a point you will control your fate, by going to school and doing good, or working hard, if you don't, you should not be considered over someone better then you because of race...
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But that doesn't really have to do with what I am asking. I am asking what you think about the government trying to compensate to blacks for what didn't happen to them.
 
It's so dreadfully blatantly unfair I feel.
So unless someone has an opposing view, this is not much of discussion.
 
Tyrone Biggums said:
But that doesn't really have to do with what I am asking. I am asking what you think about the government trying to compensate to blacks for what didn't happen to them.
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Of course the government will try to right wrongs that were done, and like money, family property, I suppose the stress and burdens that your ancestors endured. Why shouldn't they recieve what there parents should have.


I am with you though, I believe that nobody deserves anything, and they should have to earn everything...
 
Tyrone Biggums said:
I'm not saying that, I am saying people who weren't affected at all by the actions trying to be compensated for shouldn't be compensated.
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You seem to have assumed that my skin is NOT tan-yellow with a hint of pink.
Perhaps a question was a bit inappropriate, but it summed up my views perfectly.


Having dark skin isn't a disadvantage. If anything it's an advantage, with all the Affirmative Action not just governmentally but socially as well. For example, when casting for a television show, who is chosen: The 10 good white actors, or 9 of the good white actors, and one black cardboard actor?
 
Muffinator said:
You seem to have assumed that my skin is NOT tan-yellow with a hint of pink.
Perhaps a question was a bit inappropriate, but it summed up my views perfectly.


Having dark skin isn't a disadvantage. If anything it's an advantage, with all the Affirmative Action not just governmentally but socially as well. For example, when casting for a television show, who is chosen: The 10 good white actors, or 9 of the good white actors, and one black cardboard actor?
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I heard that 1 in 3 people in advertisements are black, not sure if that is true. What Shredder said is true though, it can be a disadvantage. There of course is, and always will be, racism. You think all employers really do that for diversity?
 
Tyrone Biggums said:
I heard that 1 in 3 people in advertisements are black, not sure if that is true. What Shredder said is true though, it can be a disadvantage. There of course is, and always will be, racism. You think all employers really do that for diversity?
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Hopefully not, but it has to hurt any business to have to loser a better person suited for a job for these stupid reason, I wonder how long Affirmative action will remain.
 
Shredderbeam said:
This (the United States) is a country where each person is the determiner of their own fate, and can make for themselves anything they choose. If you are born with a disadvantage, then the resources should be available to you (and everybody else) for you to make that up, but I'll be damned if you get favored over a better student because of your skin color.
Click to expand...

I couldn't have phrased it better myself. But it is worth mentioning that what most people don't realize is affirmative action can also include the place you grew up, your religion, and your sex.

I challenge ANYONE on here to find me a scholarship within the United States that can only be applied to by white men. I can find ones for black people (American Negro College Fund), for women (Would take me 3 seconds to google), and ones for people of certain religions (see women). But no, if there's one only for white people, they're racist, one for only men, they're sexist, one for only white men, they're racist sexist nutjobs. Right?

People say all the time how people in Detroit (No, I'm not being racist, read on before saying anything) have a horrible time, and they aren't given the proper tools to learn. Well, let me tell you something. I spent the first 9 years of my school life in the Detroit Public School system. I was one of 7 white people at our whole school, and probably the only one the other kids talked to. Now I'm not saying this is all about being white and loved by black people, or anything like that. My point is a 3.0 at that school was FAR easier to get an a 3.0 at my current school. Its all about SELF MOTIVATION anywhere you go! In fact, its easier in the schools where half of our teachers didn't show up.

People are trying so hard to be politically correct (i.e. the term "African American", which implies that all people come from Africa, ignoring that black people can come from Haiti, Jamaica, and other countries), that we're just ticking people off. I mean c'mon. My dad works for Ford. Now, even if he's the best guy to get a promotion, in some cases, he can't! Why? Because at each level of Ford they are required to have a certain number of minorities and people of different sexes. Now there's even talk of having people with different sexual preferences. Teachers in our school can't post signs that say "Merry Christmas" on the wall, even if it also has "Happy Hannukah" and "Merry Kwanza". No, it has to be HAPPY HOLIDAYS. You can't even find an advertisements where 1 out of every 4 or so people aren't black and/or a woman, despite the fact I remember reading somewhere less than 15% of the US population is black. I can't even hold a door open for the girl behind me as I walk out, even if she's only one step behind me (therefore preventing the door from smacking her in the face - a courtesy I would apply to a man or woman), for fear of getting a "what, you don't think I can hold the door open for myself because I'm a woman!?!". Teachers at are school are now afraid of reporting girls for wearing pants that are smaller than my hand for fear of being tagged "sexist", even if they're a woman. It's not because you're a woman, its because you're dressing like a whore.

You know what then, fine. Women, you want fairness? Stop your woman only scholarships (men don't have them), stop your womens activists groups (men don't get them), stop removing all the customs we've had for centuries (feminists - if you think not shaving supports your cause, you're wrong. You don't see me going around getting breast implants and then thinking I'm entitled to call everyone I want sexist). Holding the door open for someone isn't sexist. Its common courtesy. Minorities/Religious groups, stop making such a big scene! By having things like affirmative action, you get people pissed that normally wouldn't have cared. You make a big deal out of small things. So what if the missing mother on the news was white and not black. How many white people do you think go "oh, look. another white missing mom. I think I'll not like black people because my racist news broadcasters only care about white people". They probably only notice somethings up when they see the crazy rioters out in front of the news station that week because the company didn't meet their quota of missing minority parents for the week. Same thing goes for you as women! Get rid of the United Negro College fund. Make it one for anybody who needs it. Your commercials that show that black people need your money for college only engrains the idea in employers that all black people come from crappy communities. So what if they've got good grades, that ones commerical said that black people are put down their whole life, grow up in poor areas, and have crappy schools. Maybe that one white guy whos a bit less qualified will be a better people person.

I mean, c'mon. It's always more more more more more. Give and take is how it works.

Side Note: Michigan finally shot down affirmative action in the last voting cycle.
 
Well u made some good points, and im a minority as well.
interesting extremely.
 
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