PayPal Donations

[S]

Just wondering why DIRECT PayPal donations accepted.

Judging by Sythes history, and the tendency for scammers to pertain to this site, wouldn't it be wise to not accept PayPal donations?

My reasoning is, and I'm not saying everyone who donates via PayPal is, however it's better to be safe than sorry.

Scammers who simply come to Sythe to scam will do anything to achieve there means. There have been a handful of people in the past who donate via PayPal in sums of up to $200 and then go on a scamming spree.

Newcomers / people new to the market aren't familiar with taking the correct precautions, and generally assume a $200 Donator rank, or even $100/$50 for that matter makes the individual 'trusted', and end up getting scammed.

What's to stop people from donating $1000 via PayPal, then going on a scamming spree. Even if they amount a 50M scam, it's still PROFIT... as they simply chargeback on paypal.

I don't see any viable or positive outcomes via allowing donations directly through PayPal. If they were actually legitimate, I'm sure they can go one step further, and use their PayPal funds to buy RSGP via playerauctions and donate, or simply use TBT's Playerauctions service.

 

[Hostblapstat]

I agree with you 100%, people can literally just join, get the requirements to donate via paypal and then easily scam some vulnerable newcomer.

 

To try and prevent this you have to donate to $5 donator via another means before donating via paypal is available to you. I know what you mean however but there isn't much they can do really. I doubt paypal donations will be removed also as they encourage more people to donate.

 

[S]

So I googled a bit of information that I could find in the past few months.

$200 Donator, Synful, PayPal: Scammed 3B RSGP, by simply having the $200 donator rank. (You can find his threads in the Donator Lounge/Via his disputes. He even stated, Donating $200 via PayPal made him instantly more trusted within the community).

$100 Donator, Sterblich, PayPal: Used stolen PayPal's/bank accounts and scammed around 10Bish, via charging back, after acquiring a 'trust status', due to his donation rank. People assumed he wouldn't charge-back.

I'll try look for more. I'm sure there are others, I just don't about them.

 

[paypalwiz]

So I googled a bit of information that I could find in the past few months.

$200 Donator, Synful, PayPal: Scammed 3B RSGP, by simply having the $200 donator rank. (You can find his threads in the Donator Lounge/Via his disputes. He even stated, Donating $200 via PayPal made him instantly more trusted within the community).

$100 Donator, Sterblich, PayPal: Used stolen PayPal's/bank accounts and scammed around 10Bish, via charging back, after acquiring a 'trust status', due to his donation rank. People assumed he wouldn't charge-back.

I'll try look for more. I'm sure there are others, I just don't about them.

There is always one person to ruin it for everyone else. I just donated with paypal and love how easy it is instead of the other options. on the other hand if people are going to scam they are going to scam. How they donated doesn't change their ability to scam others. If someone is using stolen paypals/bank accounts they could get a donation rank through playerauctions as well.

 

[S]

on the other hand if people are going to scam they are going to scam.

That's wrong.

Having a $1000/$200/$500 Donation rank will greatly help someone to scam, that's obvious. Not everyone who donates has stolen PayPal's and what not, and they simply use there DONATION RANK to scam, then chargeback their donation rank.

I understand your point, but I am heavily against PayPal donations.

 

[Sebastian Vael]

I do not support this, the people above where just two - and anyway if you chargeback on Paypal its a permanent ban, if you want to donate via Paypal you first have to donate via other means like RSGP, would be better to keep it.

 

[S]

I do not support this, the people above where just two - and anyway if you chargeback on Paypal its a permanent ban, if you want to donate via Paypal you first have to donate via other means like RSGP, would be better to keep it.

Think logically. Those have just been two cases, there are far, far more.

I'm not sure if you're trolling, or you cant understand lol.

OBVIOUSLY, you will be permanently banned if you chargeback, but that is irrelevant? The point is, they chargeback anyway, they don't care if they get banned. Its simple, Donate>Scam>Ban>Chargeback. They will always chargeback, them getting banned isn't a factor.

Also, donating $5 via RSGP first is hardly going to prevent anything. The way a scammer would see it, they would see the $5 via RSGP as a stepping stone. Donate that amount in RSGP, then donate $1000 via PayPal and scam a few bills, and proceed to chargeback.

I feel you need to view this from an unbiased opinion. Granted you donated via PayPal (seb/paypalwizz), but the negatives are far worse than the positives.

 

[Sebastian Vael]

I understand what you are saying, but most that donate here including myself and you wouldn't even think of scamming because they have donated to sythe, there are exceptions like those above, if any more.

 

[S]

I understand what you are saying, but most that donate here including myself and you wouldn't even think of scamming because they have donated to sythe, there are exceptions like those above, if any more.

You haven't been here long enough to know what people are capable of. Yes, boatloads of people would scam given the opportunity. That isn't the case at hand though.

If your true goal is to help Sythe, then going that one small, teeny, tiny, extra step and donating via RSGP/PA, shouldn't be an issue.

I feel I've made all the necessary points, I'll leave it at that.

 

[GodGenesis]

You also need to consider that the trust factor does not come in with just a donator rank, no matter how high it is.

I will see the trustworthiness of a person as an entire package which includes number of quality vouches, how long they have been on sythe, their post count and any other Moderator rank etc.

If you see a 100 post with a $1000 donator rank with very little vouches, I would be very cautious of that guy.

 

[S]

Newcomers/New people to the market, don't make that association, GodGenesis. Clearly I do, and most other Marketeer's, but not everyone does.

 

[Brendan]

That's wrong.

Having a $1000/$200/$500 Donation rank will greatly help someone to scam, that's obvious. Not everyone who donates has stolen PayPal's and what not, and they simply use there DONATION RANK to scam, then chargeback their donation rank.

I understand your point, but I am heavily against PayPal donations.

Firstly, trust is subjective. Most people know having a donation rank doesn't really add any trust, but some people believe that it is, but that's there choice. The staff can have threads and push things as much as they want but people are always going to take risks and believe someone is trustworthy when they're not. Removing PayPal donation ranks won't be able to stop that.

Secondly, it's easy to donate without PayPal anyway. Someone can just buy a load of RSGP from someone, with PayPal, and then donate the RSGP through TBT, etc. Are we going to get rid of these options too? The only reason I feel PayPal donations should ever be removed is if people kept disputing there donations.

 

[Karl]

If a User is going to scam 10B then they're going to do it, theres nothing we can do to stop them except highly suggest certain trading methods and Middlemen, this has nothing to do with Donating.

The only solution to what you think is the problem (people donating for donor ranks to scam) is to remove a) Donating and/or b) Donation ranks.

without a, sythe will die, without b, sythe will die due to no incentive to donate except goodwill, which only a few members would actually do that. We leave it up to the users to decide how much they trust someone and how they value the trust that is 'awarded' through donar ranks.

The only thing possible is that we continue making sure people check out who they're buying from first, check how often they're posting on threads recently asking for lots of gold, use middlemen, etc.

 

[Deathsnova]

Huge newbie detected. They actually allowed paypal donations after a long line of suggestions and battling from the community, i actually donated $15 the night before i was banned =/

So yeah they have the $5 and 100 post and a few month prerequisite.

 

[GodGenesis]

Newcomers/New people to the market, don't make that association, GodGenesis. Clearly I do, and most other Marketeer's, but not everyone does.

There's really nothing much you can do about it. I don't really see the big commotion about people donating through Paypal anyway. Its more convenient and encourages people to increase their donation.

Ultimately, its safe trading practises that prevent scams.

 

[Sebastian Vael]

I myself have donated trough Paypal (100$) i can tell its far more convenient than other payment methods, and its instant.

 

[S]

Huge newbie detected. They actually allowed paypal donations after a long line of suggestions and battling from the community.

I already know this.


@Karl, if someone is going to scam, having a $1000 donation that they can can chargeback at any time will clearly help in them scamming alot more, so yes, it does matter.

 

[Brendan]

@Karl, if someone is going to scam, having a $1000 donation that they can can chargeback at any time will clearly help in them scamming alot more, so yes, it does matter.

Right now, the system is working though. I mean in the future if Sythe/Matthew had a load off issues with chargebacks I can see why they'd remove it, but PayPal is one of the more popular choices and they're getting a lot of donations through it, so why remove it if it isn't a problem?

 

[S]

This can be closed then.