The hypocracy of democracy.

1) We DO have free trade. Anyone has the ability to start up a company.
2) Welfare isn't just for the poor. It's for those who need the extra help to make it through college as well so they can go on to be better at whatever profession they so choose to pursue.
3) Oregan has no taxes. They're not doing much better than any of their neighboring states. As a Washingtonian, I can vouch for that.
4) I believe if someone is innovative enough to procure an idea or a product that is good enough to become a major corporation's selling point, then they deserve to live an easy life...
5) If a business has bad service or is too expensive, then another business with higher standards and lower rates will pull ahead when people realize it's better for them to switch preferred companies... this is constantly happening, and anyone can be the next preferred service if they know how to run a business correctly..

I feel like we're really starting to stray from the original debate, which I thought was "democracy is evil and hypocritical because we can't vote to throw it off"..

 

The original argument was outlined in my last post, which you conveniantly ignored.
America does not have a free market, the government interferes constantly.
If i a person comes up with an improvement for aforementioned product should he be sued for trying to market it?
And there is several instances where no real competition is possible, take microsoft for example, the government has put them in a position where no other operating system can compete because of hundreds of copyrights on important system functions.

 

Microsoft's competition is Macintosh.. And last time I checked, they're doing pretty well. And then there's linux, unix, ubuntu, all of those, and they have their crowd as well.

Stealing ideas and trying to improve them and market them is against the law. That doesn't mean the government is restricting free trade because that's NOT what free trade means. Just like freedom of speech doesn't apply when you're plagiarizing work. You can turn in a college paper that you stole from someone else and say you have a right to say it/write it, but you don't have a right to benefit off of it because it's not yours. Someone else worked to be recognized with that paper, just like people work to be recognized by their products.

The reason I may have ignored whatever point you've outlined is because it's not part of the original post. Up to my last post, all discussion was off track, and after you posted in response, I didn't have anything to say about it because I haven't thought on it. It wasn't presented in the original debate, so I didn't bother myself with trying to debate it in an effort to stay on track.

Anyway, by your wording, it sounds like you're starting to take a lot of this personally, so I'm going to stop debating the matter unless you want to continue.... "professionally", for lack of a better term. I could be wrong, I just don't want the debate to irk you at all, I'm responding so you can see the other side of the issue

 

Microsoft linux and macintosh all cover completely different areas and are not in direct competition.
I just dont see how the state does anything that cant be handled better privately.

 

I don't either. Whenever the government tries to run something, it inevitably becomes so huge and so tangled up in red tape, it can't function. Plus the government doesn't have any reason to operate in an efficient, professional manner like a private business does.

 

Hmm that's weird

 

Exactly, and the government can stifle competition.
Along with ip making innovation illegal the whole world is being held back technologically.
The wright brothers are famous for inventing the plane (in american history classes)
What they really did was invented the small rudder that allows you to control a plane properly, then they copyrighted this small part and sued any one attempting to use it, whilst already using parts other teams had came up with..
By the time war rolled arround america was so far behind in aeroplane development that they had to borrow planes from france.

 

This is just my thoughts, but I see the US government as it currently is being overthrown in the very near future. It's growing bigger and bigger by the month, and eventually the people will either get tired of it and overthrow it, or just switch to full blown communism if the dependent class is that large. No form of government has ever lasted forever. Even the great Rome went through 3 different periods of government (Monarchy, Republic, Imperial). Although it was always the empire of Rome the government controlling it was not always the same.

That doesn't make what they're doing right.

Try not paying taxes anywhere in the world and see what happens. You get killed. Now of course it's not as simple as shooting someone in the head, but the long process it takes eventually leads to your death or imprisonment.

If you think the United States is free trade then you've got your definitions completely mixed up.

When it's stolen from others I don't care whether the consequence is a bad one or a good one, the money paying for it is still stolen.

 

The United States is not a true democracy. It is also no where near the most perfect form of government. There is no way to fix many of the issues that are present in the United States so you have to deal with them.

 

I think one major flaw is the 2 party system, liberals and labour, i wouldnt vote for either of them if i had a choice in the matter.
If i cant have a free society at least give me a choice that i can actually relate to in any way.
Its like i get to vote between some one shitting im my mouth or up my nose, i dont really find either choice attractive then they tout it as freedom.

 

Do you honestly believe any of the BULLSHIT you have just said? The only reason you are allowed to post this thread is because you have freedom. In many other places people are killed for less. You should be thankful that your able to wake up in the morning and not have propaganda shoved down your throat. You have no idea how lucky you are.

If you don't believe me try moving to India or Mexico and let me know what its like.

 

A free range is not freedom.

A cow has a free range, but he is certainly not free. He is still fenced in (border lines), in order to leave he needs permission from the farmer (Customs and passports), and is milked daily (taxes).

 

Are you serious? Your little cow reference is completely different.

Border lines show the end and start of country's i don't understand what you were trying to say.

There is customs and passports to ensure smuggling and illegal immigration are suppressed. I don't about you but id rather my plane not explode when im travailing on it because you feel people should be able to leave country's as they please.


How do you expect to have any type of government without taxes?

 

How so? The actions are completely the same, it's only the "means" that are different.

A cow cannot leave the farm, just as we cannot leave ours without the farmer's permission. The government can deny you permission from leaving the farm, just as it can deny you entry.

That's the point, I don't except to have any time of government.

 

Grab a dictionary, look up freedom, you clearly have no knowledge on the subject.
Mexico isnt as bad as people make out, in some areas its a lot better then parts of the usa.

I dont care about smuggling or immigration, and no one would be trying to blow up planes if there wasnt a government pissing them off.
I dont want any kind of government.

 

No government? And what would you have us do twiddle our dicks? Without a government there is nothing. In every society that has ever existed has had some form of government. Because you don't wanna pay taxes or what ever reason you feel that this government isnt working doeskin mean we should scrap it and allows chaos and anarchy to rampage the streets.


Get your head out your ass and think about what your asking for.

Africa has no government, hows that working out for them?

 

Let me ask you do you think slavery is right aswell? Since every society that has ever existed until the mid 1800's had some form of slavery. Without slavery there is nothing.

/sarcasm.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_consequences

Freedom.

Every piece of land on this earth is under the jurisdiction of some form of State, yes even Somalia.

Maybe once you quit being an incompetent moron, and maybe do some damn research, cause just me you show you need it. Then we can discuss this issue a little better.

 

Look at the state of the government. It is bigger than it has ever been, it is spending more than it has ever spent. If you want to allow the government to continue to drag this country and the economy down the toilet, that is your right. But I have to disagree.

You are aware Africa is a continent, and therefore made up of different countries? And all of those countries have a form of government.

 

Voluntaryism.

 

ok look. what your asking for is an infinite.

you wish to be able to do anything you wish whenever you wish to do it.

sooo... is the government limiting your freedom by not inventing things that you cannot do right now?
after all, if they could be inventing something that extends your freedom but are not, they are limiting your freedom.

or what about this:

you want your neighbors house. you claim that if you cant have it your not experiencing freedom.
so is the government limiting your freedom by not giving you your neighbors house?




jesus, no government can give us complete freedom. what we can brag about is having a hell of a lot more freedom than the rest of the world.