Rules on who goes first.

[Poison_Mindset]

I've decided to come up with a proposal which would hopefully make this site safer and protect the honest and genuine people who trade over sythe.org. It would also stop a lot of time wasting.

I propose that unless you have a minimum amount of vouches (I say 10-20) from OMM's or some other trusted sources, you are notallowed to state you won't go first in your trade threads. OMM's or MM's must be used.

When that person has reached a certain amount of proven vouches they would then be allowed to be more picky, but common sense must still prevail. (IE: 20 vouches does not entitle you to claim you will not go first to 1000 vouches)

I've done trades on here before for different games and different currencys and I've never stated I won't go first. If the trade has been with a fellow newbie I have always used a MM. If the trade has been with someone like say.. $500 donator, I always go first or do increments if it is a larger trade.

The reason I suggest this idea is because I am sick of trying to do honest and genuine business only to be told by someone who joined the day before and has 3 post count, that "I am not going first. L2Read" The idea is ludicrous that anyone would go first to me with my small amount of vouches. The same goes for the other person. That is what the OMM's are for.

I know that this does happen now and a lot of people on here do follow their common sense. But there is still a large amount who do not.

Upsides:
Less chance of scammers. (Never going to be rid 100%)
More fluency in trading. Less time wasted arguing that you will not go first.
Easier to conduct business with set guidelines.
More business for MM.

Downsides:
Extra work for mods
Some users may be here only for 1 trade

 

[Moes]

minimum 10 vouches from OMM's?
lol? why should the vouches come from OMM's?
and btw there probs are not even 10 OMM's on Sythe.
do you think a vouch from OMM is worth more than a regular vouch?

i would say NO
vouches is about quality not about quantity

 

[Poison_Mindset]

minimum 10 vouches from OMM's?
lol? why should the vouches come from OMM's?
and btw there probs are not even 10 OMM's on Sythe.
do you think a vouch from OMM is worth more than a regular vouch?

Not at all, I probably didn't explain clearly enough. In the case of two people who both have no vouches or very low amount, common sense would say use a MM.

In the case of someone already deemed trusted, then of course their vouch would count.

The trouble is though that it's not exactly a trustworthy vouch to say that you paid first because no trust really fell on you. At least with a MM it would be a vouch to say "Yes they were genuinely attempting to make a trade." Rather than "Yes he paid me £20 so i gave him some gold in return." if that makes sense.

I know it is difficult to come up with any clear rules because you can never tell each individuals motives at the end of the day. This was mostly brought about because of frustration with stubborn people or scammers who believe they have some kind of divine right to refuse to ever go first. (Even with a MM)

 

[Nytrix]

The reason I suggest this idea is because I am sick of trying to do honest and genuine business only to be told by someone who joined the day before and has 3 post count, that "I am not going first. L2Read"

The majority of people who say this end up being banned for scamming by the end of the day. Simply either avoid them, or introduce a middleman if they are urging you to trade first.

 

[Poison_Mindset]

The majority of people who say this end up being banned for scamming by the end of the day. Simply either avoid them, or introduce a middleman if they are urging you to trade first.

Precisely which, in my opinion, anyone genuinely wanting to trade would agree to anyway. The fact of having a guideline in place would act as a deterrent if nothing else.

 

[S]

No. People can decide with whom they want to trade with, and how the trade should progress. No one is forced into a trade or forced to use a MM/OMM. Be vigilant and you're fine in nearly all situations.

No support.

 

[Nytrix]

Precisely which, in my opinion, anyone genuinely wanting to trade would agree to anyway. The fact of having a guideline in place would act as a deterrent if nothing else.

This idea will never work. There will be so many loopholes that it wouldn't even be worth the effort of developing a guideline.

 

[SuF]

We aren't going to regulate how people do business. There are plenty of perfectly honest people who have no vouches. There is also no way to enforce this.

 

[Syed]

Sythe is firmly against any type of limiting or unfair advantage of any sort in the market, afaik. Going by vouches just gives more incentive for people to fake vouches.

If they won't use an OMM or MM and are strictly only going first, then simply don't trade with them, it's not particularly hard.

 

[Poison_Mindset]

I don't get it. You seem to be against something which will help protect the honest people on the site. Maybe this particular idea would not work but I don't see anything in place to protect people who are genuine other than banning people who let's face it.. can quite easily come back on a new account.

It's like your saying that it's OK to scam if you fall for it. Sure, have vigilance and use common sense is good advice but personally.. I don't think it's enough and I don't even see that anybody even cares about it. It's fine for all you guys with countless vouches who can legitimately refuse to go first, you risk absolutely nothing. What about the people who don't come on here often or are new? Trying to get trusted vouches is next to impossible. Trying to complete a risk free trade without over paying or covering hefty fees is also extremely difficult.

Perhaps try to see things not only from your own perspectives.

Sorry but the way I see it at the moment is:

Either buy from someone trusted with high vouches, which will be at the top end prices.
Take the risk and buy from non trusted, lower price but high risk of scamming.

Sell to someone trusted, get a low end price.
Sell to someone not trusted, maybe make more, but again risk of scam is high.

But I guess for you guys that is fine and it's not supposed to be a fair market.

 

[kfjjjdst]

Sell to someone trusted, get a low end price.
Sell to someone not trusted, maybe make more, but again risk of scam is high.

But I guess for you guys that is fine and it's not supposed to be a fair market.

Well, there's a very simple way to earn quite reasonable trust:

When I used to sell pins back in the day, I first bought pins from bigger named sellers or sold them too, and I went first; I collected quite a few vouches, and people started going first to me; and I never ever got scammed, nor got ripped off.

Fair market?
First of all, if you forced members into trading into a specific way, they do not please, THAT would be an unfair market, IMO.
You may use an OMM at your discretion anytime; Are you scared of being scammed by newcomers, who say you go first or no trade? Well, don't trade them then; Not like anyone is holding you at gunpoint to trade them with you going first. I don't see how the market is unfair; There are unwritten rules on sythe.org (which I have noticed) for who goes first or whether OMM's shall be used.

Absolutely no support from me. Infact it appears to me, you want this, because you want Newcomers to go first to you; I would never go first to you, so I understand why others don't either.

Bottom line again: No.

EDIT: You do realise, these 2 posts say the opposite: First you want vouches from trusted users, then you claim if you deal with trusted users, you will get a low end price definitely. So this make sense how?

Sell to someone trusted, get a low end price.
Sell to someone not trusted, maybe make more, but again risk of scam is high.

But I guess for you guys that is fine and it's not supposed to be a fair market.

I propose that unless you have a minimum amount of vouches (I say 10-20) from OMM's or some other trusted sources, you are notallowed to state you won't go first in your trade threads. OMM's or MM's must be used.

 

I don't get it. You seem to be against something which will help protect the honest people on the site. Maybe this particular idea would not work but I don't see anything in place to protect people who are genuine other than banning people who let's face it.. can quite easily come back on a new account.

It's like your saying that it's OK to scam if you fall for it. Sure, have vigilance and use common sense is good advice but personally.. I don't think it's enough and I don't even see that anybody even cares about it. It's fine for all you guys with countless vouches who can legitimately refuse to go first, you risk absolutely nothing. What about the people who don't come on here often or are new? Trying to get trusted vouches is next to impossible. Trying to complete a risk free trade without over paying or covering hefty fees is also extremely difficult.

Perhaps try to see things not only from your own perspectives.

Sorry but the way I see it at the moment is:

Either buy from someone trusted with high vouches, which will be at the top end prices.
Take the risk and buy from non trusted, lower price but high risk of scamming.

Sell to someone trusted, get a low end price.
Sell to someone not trusted, maybe make more, but again risk of scam is high.

But I guess for you guys that is fine and it's not supposed to be a fair market.

How is it not a fair market? It's an open market in which Sythe does not want to regulate. If people are dumb enough to go first to non-trusted people, then there's nothing staff could do about it. Official middlemen are there for a reason, use them.

Jesus what's up with the recent influx of dumb suggestions about regulating the market.

 

[n4n0]

We don't do price controls or market interventions. End of discussion.

From Sythe himself. Closed.


Source: http://www.sythe.org/11872150-post30.html