I resign from being a Middleman.

Amen!

 

all your efforts for 25/25 mms for nothing, no wonder you support bringing the rank back.

 

Lolowned by xjaa.

/claps.

 

Funny you should say that; I had it in block capitals in my MSN name, yet it was completely and utterly ignored.

 

Shhh =p

yeh but no really, im being serious, its giving a wider group of people a chance to scam. Im not just saying that cause i dont have the rank lol.

 

Lol @ all you people saying MMs have worked hard for nothing. They made money from it, and to put it simply, the staff (or at least, I) don't feel the slightest bit sorry for them.

We gave them the privilege to use our markets and traders willing to trust them. It was a privilege, not a right, and we've taken it away just as easily. As for it being a complete distrust of our own userbase, yes, that's right. If there are any rats in the system, now is when they'd show themselves. We can't have that happen.

Scams and chaos will occur regardless of whether we have 1, 5, 10, or even 50 official middlemen, so why take the risk of letting someone use their rank to scam?

 

^^^^^

 

Stop responding to MM requests. The sooner they realize that you don't respond to that kind of thing, the sooner they'll learn that you don't MM.


















.

 

Amen ^^

Anyone can easily see why official middle mans would now start scamming, therefore anyone can see why its necessary to remove the ranks.

If anyone is however looking for a mm, i suggest using a global Mod. Im not sure if all of them will be willing to.. but its worth a go.

 

Mind me asking? Whats on January 1st?

 

Although I agree with the removal of the Middleman rank -(the risk was simply too big,)- I have to ask what makes you think Middlemen should start scamming now? If they were scammers, surely they would have scammed someone quite some time ago.

 

Jagex will invert a rule where you can only trade stuff within 3000 gp of eachother item.

Say a rune scimmy is 25K, and the guy says he wants 30k for it, you cant because thats not 3k within the value of the item.

And hey heres the shitty thing, Jagex decides what the price of items are.

And the mm thing, since you receive for example 1M for mming a pin, you cant do that. The person would have to give you 3k EVERY 15 MINUTES!!

Probably because some of the most trusted users was only here to MM, when they've taken away the rank they have nothing to do anymore. No goal.
So they think sythe is gonna shut down or something, and might aswell abuse their almighty vouches and postcounts to mm.

 

To answer that is very easy.

Middlemen make alot of middleman fees. They don't scam becuase, in the long run it would turn out worse for them. Also all middleman are legit, fair and nice people. So if they are going to make it as far as actually getting a rank they shouldn't scam to start with.

But once www.sythe.org 's exsistance is being threatend by runescapes new updates, the money middlemen make would dry up hit jan. Therefore in every middlemans head the bad voice would start saying "scam someone when you still can!"

Now most middlemen would ignore the voice and not scam at all becuase as stated before they are good people, but there could be a bad apple in the bunch. Atleast one... Well there mightent be, but obviously thats a risk we shouldn't take, and obviously sythe doesn't think we should either.

The reason for the ranks removal is logical. However without a doubt all middlemen should still be respected, honoured, thanked. Just not trusted. Unless of course the trader/s decide to trust you anyhow.

I personally think you should all get ex-middleman ranks, however that rank could be used in the same way that the middleman rank by itself could. But thats another debate.

Hopefully now you understand ehh?

 

Gold selling is dead.... so i dont see why people would want you to mm them if you wont get paid any more

 

SMR, and all those feeling the removal of the rank will help;
Your logic has a few holes that need poking.

Of course the removal of the rank will make it harder for ex-officials to scam, but if they wanted to turn bad, they still could. And hell, they'd walk away with a nice profit anyway.

The current ex-officials still have TONS and TONS of people willing to trust them. And the fact they USED to be an official is enough for them to get some of the biggest trades out there without anyone mistrusting them.

If there really were such rotten apples in the basket, the only way to purge it is by banning them all. Get rid of the apples as a whole. And we all know that isn't going to happen, simply due to the fact it would be so immensely unfair.

I don't feel sorry for them, I have to admit to that. They had their run, and they made their money. The removal of the rank isn't cruel at all.

However, it really won't help that much. As a matter of fact, it's made trading allot harder for those wanting to sell their last bit of gold, or do a last few trades until the January update hits.
There will most likely be more scams from the lack of officials, than there would be with them.

You should have waited until January with removing the official MM rank, just for the sake of the masses.

 

I find it atrocious that you have the nerve to suggest we have 'voices in our heads' telling us to scam.

I most certainly don't, I daresay you must be speaking from personal experience, you vicious little adder.

 

Apparently one small aspect has been overlooked. Ok, I lied, two.

First, there are still going to be many RSNs for RL money trades going on. This update doesn't affect those WHAT SO EVER.

Second, there is more money being scammed now because of this, than all of the MMs together if we scammed. You're basically saying, well, we'll be stopping these members from scamming 100M, but in the process 500M more will be lost than if this wasn't done in the first place.

It reminds me of Jagex's logic...

As Mentis said, if I honestly wanted to scam, I easily could, rank or not. Let's see how many officials, or used to be officials scam during this time? The answer will be none.

I can scam just as much right now if I wanted than if I had the rank still. It's called trust, and some faith in your own members, obviously you have none in us.

 

And you think our distrust is completely groundless? I don't deny we don't trust our members... If I had time I would respond properly to these posts, but at the moment I'm busy.

 

I'm just a little bit confused as to why people are still making MM app threads if MM ranks are all removed...

They've never really meant anything to me anyways. I mean, when I looked for a MM I didn't care who had "Middleman" or "Mod" by their name. Look at Mountain Drew, Atomic (I guess), etc.

To me, R2P is an example of the perfect person to use for the job. I'd imagine that he goes out of his way to avoid getting hacked, etc because it would result in a loss of business, mming profits, and if its his RS account, gold. Likewise, scamming over any amount of GP would result in something similar. He would have lost his booming business, friends that he has here, and maybe credibility elsewhere. It's all about motivation.

Just because someone was active in the forums long enough to become a mod or didn't scam during a few 12M+ trades doesn't mean that when a rare comes along they won't strike then. Having that "Middleman" or "Mod" label means almost nothing.

This is even more true with the people you are leaving MMing to now. People are putting apps up with their first post. If you don't believe me, just look at the MM forum. It's littered with fake vouches, vouches from accounts they own, etc. By no means am I saying Post count = Credibility, but joining the same day you make your MM thread is pushing it a bit far. They have even less motivation than those deemed "Official Middleman".

Dorito brings up an excellent point. Account sales will still go on after this, and gold trades are happening now more than ever. Right now it's a choice between those who have proven themselves (to various degrees) and in doing so have grown close to the Sythe community, or people who have 150 posts in 3 days and 5 threads in the "Report a Scammer" forum about them.

The people who held that Middleman title have something to lose, and whether or not it means very little or very much to them, they still have more to lose than the Middlemen people are now resorting to, who by the way, also fit into your "if they're going to scam they'll do it now" concept even more than Official MM. People are probably losing more on these types of people than they would if an Official MM chose to be dishonest.

If the people that went through the MM proces truely wanted to scam, they probably would have done it long before Jagex began to hone in on imbalanced trades, drop trades, removed the staking option, and real world trading in general. Mentis brings up a good point in saying that not having the Official MM label changes nothing. If I had the choice between someone with a join date in 05 and a degree of ties to the community though their 1000+ posts I'll surely pick them over the guy who joined yesterday. It would be just as easy for them to scam without the title.

Here's what needs to happen. People are desperate for trusted MMs. Standards are dropping fast, and amounts of gold are rising. We need to indicate to people who has proven themselves in the past, rather than keeping people guessing. RWT has always been a risk for all the parties involved. Nothing has changed. Someone with that official MM rank scam now, and they may not. Nobody knows. But again, we go back to motivation. People proved themselves and became a part of the community. Being shut out offers some incentive to be honest, a hundred times more than what the Middlemen people are currently using have. All past MM should be given the option to take back their MM title or refuse it. Those who accept can choose to raise their fees in the hopes they come across truely serious people, or leave them as they are. They can even go as far as saying "don't bother me if it's any less than 50M, no pins or accounts", further decreasing their requests. Dorito =/= Buciukaz, and it needs to be shown to those who are effected by it.

EDIT: MMs won't use their rank to scam any more than people use post count or fake vouches. Again, they all ban the same, but people who have proved themselves are less likely to do this than people who haven't.

Sorry for repeating myself (which I'm sure I've done a hundred times by now), but the way I see it at the end of the day, people are still going to need to trades big amounts of gold, people will still scam, and people will still be banned. What we need is a way to identify the unlikely from the likely. An official MM is just as easy to ban as anyone else, and equally as likely (if not less) to scam than the other people on the boards.

 

Thank you Gnomey, I think you have put it best into words out of anyone.