Gay Marriage

I am on about just your general upbrigning, personality and behaviour. It's just not natural, you need a male and a female to make a baby, it makes sense they also bring one up.

I know what they are but regardless, I don't think we should be editing the "BIOS" of what we are made of.

Well of course they can't, I'm not saying they shouldn't be making these life choices. I'm saying they are odd and don't make any sense whatsoever.

Marriage has always been between a man and a woman. Why do two of the same gender want to get married? A civil partnership / union is the same thing in the legal eye. I just don't see the point or the need. If gay people were really that equal then we wouldn't be having "gay bars" which of course anyone can go to, but they signal they are meant for gay people only. Now if you saw a bar that stated it was a "straight bar" then gay people would start crying out "omg discrimination...!".

It's a long tricky subject and I would have voted no if the public was given the decision to vote in the UK.

 

A baby isn't going to turn out worse because it had same sex parents. And actually, same sex biological babies are actually almost possible, don't hold ya breath.

Next time you're ill don't take medication then

But they shouldn't have the same rights? Only people you think are okay should have the same rights?

At one point, black people had always been inferior to white people (arguably still are to some people). Just because something has always been the case doesn't mean it's correct.

You mean like every non-gay bar is basically a straight bar? Hit on someone of the same sex and you'll probably get punched. If you called it a straight bar but allowed gay people in, it wouldn't be discrimination now would it.

So if you don't agree with it fuck everyone else even though it effects you exactly zero?

 

I didn't say "worse", I just said "differently".

I am on about genetic engineering, not painkillers...

Well now that depends what you mean by "rights". If you mean the right to receive emergency aid, receive a lawyer at court if you can't afford one at court and so on then yes of course, no different to anyone else. Marriage is not essential to being with someone, just get a civil partnership / union.

Right but skin colour does not define gender.

No, but a gay bar is essentially insinuating that it's meant for gays.

It doesn't feel right and a child should have a mum + dad. If I'm out in public and I see two gays (any same-gender) making out, I just end up looking away in disgust. I don't mind them doing it, just do it in private.

 

so if it's not worse, it's just different, who cares? We're all different. All mums and dads are different. Jesus Christ, don't be dense.

Medical discoveries making things possible that weren't before

Why?

> We're making this thing called marriage
> You gay people aren't entitled because you're this and that
> So something else is made to get around that for the time being while also fighting for same-sex couple equality.

It's one example, stop being dense. Just because something has always been done, doesn't mean it's right.

But it isn't just meant for gays

So straight people should do it in private too.. it's rude to make out in public no matter if you're a straight couple or same-sex couple.

 

Laptop, your arguments are pretty garbage man (not surprised).

You bring up the animal kingdom like marriage exists in it.

You bring up themed establishments like entry reflects your sexuality.

You bring up traditions like they don't change for the better.

You bring up parenting like it's essential for both opposing genders to raise a child.

You're embarrassing yourself at this point.

 

I personally think that this is a good cause. Let people be the way they want to be. We shouldn't influence them in any sort of way which (can) then drastically effect our future generations. This was bound to come one day or another. And who said this is a bad influence on children? The parents influence their children in every sort of way, it would be up to the parent if they want their child to be gay or straight.

 

^ I think you mean it wouldn't be up to the parent if the child was straight or gay? There isn't any kind of statistic that says same-sex couples raise more non-straight children than hetero couples.

 

I'll edit this in later.

 

If they're the same thing you're literally just arguing semantics. And the whole "two dads/moms is too much of one gender" argument is just dumb. What do you think happens to kids with single parents?

 

you have no clue what you are talking about please get informed on the topic before you are gonna argue against it.....


marriage is civilly allowed thru the courts it has nothing to do with churches... churches still have the right to deny weddings at there establishments

also marriage allows the partner to "pull" the plug if there is ever a situation in which his signigifcant other can no longer think for themselves... this is one of the MAJOR reasons they wanted gay marriage legal.[ could you imagine if your wife said please pull the plug on me if im ever a living vegetable] and they say sorry we cant b/c you arent married even though its illegal for you to get married.


If I didnt explain it good enough or you have more questions please feel free to pm me

 

wow, you guys. that's a little mean. you may not have to agree with what he says but there is no need for the acutely patronizing and condescending tone. stay classy lol.


i think this is a great step in history, recognizing and granting free choice to all within the grounds of marriage rights. i bet the stonewall rioters never envisioned this happening. one thing that does concern me is how partial some of the marriage equality supporters are (on both sides, actually), even within this thread. just because someone doesn't agree with your opinion, doesn't condone you enforcing your views upon theirs. it's the classic lobbyist stance and it's annoying as hell... it's okay to let people have their own opinions.

 

I don't care to go pull out various parts all through the thread (some has been responded to some have not) so I'm just going to make a few overarching statements.

1. Homosexual relationships do exist among animals and is not exclusive to humans.

1A. "It's not natural." What the hell is natural? Male sea horses giving birth and other animals have been known to change their gender. Is that natural? Culture heavily influences what is "natural" and that is just among humans.

2. Sexuality is not something you choose.The argument of "you choose who you're attracted to" is utter bull. If this was the case, straight individuals could be attracted to the same sex.

2A. For arguments such as "well look at how people who say they are straight will sleep with the same sex for money, or while in prison, or whatever." Newsflash, you can have sex and not be attracted to said individual. There are homosexual people who have been in marriages with the opposite sex because they thought it was "right." That doesn't mean they were attracted to their partner.

3. Sexuality is not static, it is fluid and a spectrum. It can change, you can be straight and find yourself attracted to someone of the same sex. You do not have to identify as any sexuality, you can find no one attractive, you can find everyone attractive, it is not some thing that is just set in stone.

4. Marriage is not some inherently religious institution. Marriage may be involved in religions, but it was around before Christianity (among others such as Islam) and it will be around after; furthermore, marriage in todays society has legal ramifications. There are plenty of scenarios where partners could not see their life-time partners in hospitals because they "weren't family", or other scenarios where they were not getting the proper tax rates because they couldn't get married.

5. Arguments such as "couples cannot bare children" are bullshit. Guess we should keep women over the age of 50 from marrying. Oh and don't forget all the infertile people

5A. "Gay parents will ruin children" there is absolutely no evidence to back this up. There have been studies done on homosexual parents and effects on children and one in Australia specifically found that children had higher self esteems than that of straight children. A household with gay parents in no way prohibits them from loving their children.

Neal Patrick Harris on male/female parents:

6. Oh and all the people who are attempting to argue that they have the right to discriminate based on religious beliefs. Ex: Shop owners who say they will not serve homosexual people because of their religious beliefs. They are not asking you to have gay sex, they are buying a pizza. Your thoughts on other people's actions go out the door once you are in a public sphere. You do not control other people and they do not control you.

Fun fact: Opinions can be ignorant and complete bullshit. "Everyone is entitled to an opinion" is a phrase often backed by those who choose to ignore facts.

Ex: "Well, in my opinion global warming doesn't exist. It's alright, I'm entitled to my opinion!" Cool, your opinion is wrong. The overwhelming scientific evidence and practically the entire scientific community says the opposite. Your opinion is wrong.

Ex: "Well it is my opinion that vaccines cause autism!" Cool, again, your opinion is wrong. Scientific evidence disagrees with you.

Ex: "Well I just think being gay is wrong" or "Well I just think your race is inferior" Well, you're just an asshole in this scenario.

Was so excited when I read about it this morning and I think it's great how cities, businesses, and people have been reacting. Of course there is the dissenting voice, but it is small, ignorant, and being completely overshadowed by the support being poured out.

Like

Edit: Note: That is an edit^, but Biden was wearing an LGBT cape earlier

And Seattle repainting crosswalks


and of course all the various logos that have been changed to LGBTQ colors

Oh and shoutout to Roary for tearing shit up

 

Was going to post but this pretty much summed my thoughts up to a tee.

On the topic of everyone being entitled to their opinion.
Ever heard of the phrase there's no stupid questions? Well news flash there is. Just like "everyone is entitled to their opinion". If your opinion is based off "I think this" even though every scientific article published claims otherwise congratulations you are no longer entitled to your opinion.

 

well, that is the root meaning of "opinion"
opinion
1. a view or judgement formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.

with all due respect, opinion is not necessarily tentative or provisional to fact. in my opinion, this is especially true in the realm of this debate, where morality is subjective and not absolutely objective. sure, laptop may be constructing flawed arguments although let's not fall victim to straw man fallacy.

 

"It's not natural" is one of the stupidest counter-arguments in this topic. The appeal to nature fallacy falls flat on its face when you realise that if you were to apply it to everything, you'd probably be dead. Life-saving medicine? No thanks, it's synthetic. Car to drive to work? No thanks, they aren't naturally occurring machines. House to live in? Sorry, it has steel and plaster in it, I'm afraid I can't live in it because they're refined materials. Nevermind the fact that the scientific term "nature" is actually all-encompassing of everything that exists without supernatural phenomena (which is to say, everything, ever, that has ever existed).

Honestly, the hypocrisy is absolutely rife. Furthermore, homosexuality DOES occur in nature between other animals so that argument falls flat on its face in more ways than one. The very fact that it exists suggests it is encompassed by nature.

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I noticed someone called gender-fluidity nonsense earlier. Personally someone I care about a great deal is gender-fluid. They don't identify strictly with one gender or the other, and one day he will be wearing male clothes and binders, the other she will be wearing female clothing and makeup. They have been discriminated against because of the ignorance and lack of acceptance of difference in society despite being an absolutely amazing, loving and fun person. They don't choose to feel this way, they just do. Saying gender-fluidity is nonsense is no better than being a schoolyard bully because someone else, another human being, is different.

I myself am liberally bisexual. There are both men and women I find attractive sexually, so this issue actually affects me personally. I was discriminated against in a religious sense within the school I attended, and taught to believe that in order to be myself, I was inherently doing a bad thing. Ultimately that led to me suppressing my feelings altogether, which is a factor that led me close to suicide. I'd just like to put forward that discrimination and not treating people equally, particularly in a religious institution, can have severe and tragic effects on the people who are discriminated against.

There seems to be an argument that children have the right to a mother and a father, which is utter nonsense; how many of the people touting that argument have actually looked in to it? Suppose the child is adopted, would you rather they remain an orphan than have two (or perhaps more) parents? Personally I have, and have lived with for over 20 years, a biological mother and father. I very often can't stand being around them because I'm so different to them and they can't seem to be very considerate of that; their expectations of me are unrealistic and often hurtful. I have a family and I don't consider them a part of it. Arguing that a mother and a father make better parents is, quite frankly, bullshit.

The appeal to "motherly love" is bollocks also. It somehow implies fathers are not capable of the same level of love, which is very often demonstrated not to be the case.

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Finally I'd just like to point out that marriage is not actually an inherently religious institution to begin with. Throughout history it has been anywhere from "I like that cow, I'll give you my daughter for it" to "we need to make peace, let us marry our tribes together".

 

I don't like homosexuality - I'm not against it. Do what you wish, regardless of what I think. I believe that consists of carrying your own opinion.

HOWEVER, was it the Supreme Court's responsibility to make this decision? I don't know. I agreed with Justice Roberts and encourage you all to read the dissent. Not just the "highlights" which give you a very skewed view on the entire dissent.

Also don't know why it's so hard to point out where people went wrong without the name calling and blatant disrespect. These are your peers - treat people with respect. Especially those who represent the website as a whole.

 

I would argue it was the courts' responsibility to make said decision. When individuals liberties are at stake and it is something as simple as equal rights, it needs to be dealt with from such a standpoint.

Why? Because of tyranny by the majority. If a larger percent of the population is straight (which it is), and they are against homosexuality (majority of Americans now support it so it is irrelevant), then they can feasibly pass tyrannous laws aimed at the minority. In this case, states passed laws prohibiting gay marriage when it was their (the minorities) right to do so.

 

History shows give a dog a bone and it wants more...

No problem with Gays and Lesbians power to you good job you got one thing off your agenda but will this silence them?

My fear is that this might transcend to the education system where it encourages students/Children to be gay at that moment I'll have a problem with this.

 

I suppose. That definitely makes sense and I understand.

IDK, just crazy that it wasn't majority rules in such a democratic nation

 

What are you on about? They just want the same rights as everyone else. Why would straight children turn gay just to have the same rights they always had?