Double Imposter Scams

Basically this. It kind of falls on the hands of the buyer/seller to send good pms quite FRANKly.

One thing we can do is to reinforce how important reading stickies are as most scams can be prevented by simply doing so.

 

OP thinks if anything happens it should be the sender of the PM's fault if the other person is too careless to read it

 

@Away @Gen @Frank @Rodman

Again I think you're confused. I'm not debating the buyers safety here.

I'm debating the current system having no limitations preventing someone from impostering themself. They know they could get away with it.

All of the arguments stating that it's the buyers responsibility are irrelevant. Just because they may find someone who can't read the pms DOES NOT mean they deserved to be scammed. If you believe so please refrain from posting on this thread.

I did not ask for an argument on ethics, I simply want to address the grey area where people who are trusted users can do this scam without reparation.

 

You're literally making no sense, i have no idea what you're trying to achieve here lol

 

He thinks whenever a "double imposter" scam occurs there's no 3rd person that's attempting to scam, there's just 2 people, and the imposter is just trying to imposter his own account.
I don't think he realizes that if the person being scammed knows how to read this is easily preventable.

 

I completely agree that a reputable people can self impersonate themselves BUT the majority of people who end up self impersonating themselves end up getting caught out the game one way or another. Just look at the report that @Yousuckv2 made when Neurological tried self-impersonating himself. He got caught then ended up scam quitting later down the line. I do understand your looking for suggestions however if they want to risk losing their donator rank over scamming users then thats something that they will have to live with. Reputable users will realise they will make more money long-term by being legitimate rather than scamming users via self impersonation.

 

There's no argument to be had , add the correct Skype or click a hatscript link to add the correct Skype, it doesn't take a genius to identify whether they are talking with an impostor or not.

Thread is nothing but waffle and deserves to be closed

 

What people seem to be ignoring is the fact that these scams commonly occur with people who are new to trading.

If I was unaware of the difference between a Skype display name and a Skype profile ID I can see why people can get scammed.

A good example of what I'm trying to say is with the impostor of Crazypipe the other day

He PMed a user saying that his skype was "crazypipe_me"



A user being unaware of the difference between a Skype display name and a Skype profile id and being unaware of checking this would obviously add the user that says "crazypipe_me" as that is what they were told was the Skype, they more than likely would not even right click the second name shown in the search above to check that it would say the profile id is "live:crazypipe_me" they would instantly add them and just start a conversation or continue the conversation they were already having.

People are acting like people new to trading who join Sythe and are eager to sell their gold or accounts are fully at fault because they are not aware of this until it happens to them or they see it happen to someone else.

 

Nobody is saying that, if crazypipe sent a good PM including their skypes, the trade, and the chatlogs, it would've most likely been prevented. That's why he has a TWC.

 

Whenever I personally trade I compose a PM which closely resembles the Middleman PM Template, with that the buyer/seller should be safe.

 

This is exactly what i mentioned earlier, take note ladies and gents

 

It's late but I just want to say what I think, this is a feedback section what I say can be right or wrong and I accept that so I'm not going to be annoyed if no one understands what I'm saying or doesn't agree what I'm saying.

Can I just say I fully agree that if a person receives a skype profile id of the person they are trading with and chat logs and don't read them properly then they are at fault.

If they receive a private message along the lines of "talking to you on skype" or just replying with a skype id and nothing else then in my opinion they are not at fault if they are newcomers or haven't had relevant trading history on this site.

Know the difference between what I am saying before you reply to this post if you choose to..

I'm not talking about crazypipe I'm talking about it as a whole.

If a newcomer were to ask for a PM from a person they are talking to on Skype they would usually ask for just a PM for confirmation that they are talking to them, they wouldn't know that the person they are trading with would have to follow those PM practices because they are new, they would just expect an "I'm talking to you on skype" kind of PM.

I'll quote some posts below and bold what I am trying to get across

^ What I mean about reading Skype profile ids in my previous post

Like I mentioned, how does a newcomer know the procedures on a proper PM being sent if they just registered and are looking to trade? They would, in fact, expect exactly a "pm, talking on skype" kind of PM as all they want is confirmation they wouldn't know about the additional requirements the person they're trading with would need to do, why would they know that chatlogs is commonly used as an extra confirmation?

Again, they don't know the PM procedures if they are new to trading. Like I said with crazypipe earlier and I will talk about this because it is a good example, they read the skype name they are given but it doesn't pass their mind to check the skype profile id because they don't know about it or how it works because they see the name they were sent at the top of the skype window so they continue talking to them.

If you want to add a friend or family member on Skype would you right click their profile and check the id? Unlikely.. you would just read their Skype display name, add them and then message them elsewhere to check you added them correctly or just continue the conversation on Skype.

People would have done the same before trading on this site or on any other market site, why would they check the Skype profile ID when they have never been required to?

Again, how would a newcomer know it is a requirement to ask for chat logs or even think to ask for chat logs? Saying they deserve to be scammed when you think of it in this sense is just dumb

No they are impossible to be pulled on someone who has the ability to check Skype profile ids and know to ask for chat logs and know the requirements for PMs on this site

This is why I chose to reply because I can't believe people like you except newcomers to this site to know how to check Skype profile ids and know the PM requirements for this site like they are taught at school or something.

In what I'm covering this isn't the case and I hope reading through my post you now understand it

Again, how would new users know this template exists and be able to incorporate it into them trading safely?

It is late and my post probably doesn't all make sense but you need to think outside the box and think in some cases that the seller can be at fault as well..

 

@sj709 To begin with a 'newcomer' should not be treated as some blind child who needs guiding his way through the internet.

This is the internet and a market community, just like any other place on the internet, you need to have your wits about you and understand basic logic of trading, this can be taken just the same way as someone calling you irl and claiming to be your insurance company or your bank for example (You wouldn't just hand over details or money without CHECKING CONTACT DETAILS CAREFULLY), this form of logic applies exactly the same to when trading online.

There are plenty of stickies thread on how to avoid being scammed (If the user doesn't wish to read them, then they are to blame), many of which clearly state "check skype ID's carefully", if you cant apply simple logic when it comes to trading online, then you shouldn't be trading online.

It comes down to the fact that sythe staff are not here to babysit newcomers who haven't got a fucking two cents about trading.

 

@Rodman

You are literally offering nothing to help prevent trusted users from being able to scam without consequence, which is the subject of this thread.

Stop showing your ass about how you don't care if people get scammed.

Lastly, you speak about how it's not the responsibility of Sythe staff to babysit, or in other words prevent scams. It is their responsibility actually. And ultimately, buyers being prone to scamming is a bad image for a website or a marketplace. It should be in their ABSOLUTE INTEREST to consider anything that would help their users have a safer experience.

Now please, just stfu.

 

My first response was the way to counter these scams

An exact copy of the Skype chat with a confirmation of skype ID, which as this guy said

Follow the middleman template when trading would counter the ability for scams, this was my suggestion from my first post but for some reason you decided to go off on a tangent

 

This is essentially impossible to stop without a slip up from the guilty party. I've tackled this issue before; it just comes down to seller awareness when trading trusted users. More stickies, more welcome messages, etc. anything you can do to educate them of the dangers and how to trade safely

 

Thanks for wrapping up the obvious answer to this complete waffle of a thread, finally someone with a valued opinion will silence xour.

 

The whole point of this thread was about further suggestions on how to work towards preventing it happening or raising awareness and this is what Dunworry said at the end of his post and you agreed with him...

But you seem to have ignored the point of the actual thread resulting in you calling it a waffle of a thread when you are just talking about things already in place and how it is a person's fault that they don't read stickies etc, Dunworry is talking about more things that can be put in place even if they are already there to ensure it doesn't happen

So I'm failing to see how you agree that Dunworry has provided an answer and a valued opinion when he is contributing suggestions to prevent it further and encouraging the thread to have a further discussion when you have been trying to push the thread in the other direction?

 

For the third time, My first post was my opinion on how it could be aided , which was to apply the same PM format used by MM's to standard trades, which if you had taken the time to actually read it would of solved you typing long ass replies that no one cares about nor reads.

And if anyone has taken this thread into another direction it is you, the OP stated the use of trusted user impostering themselves and how THAT could be countered, not the generalization of every man and his nan that browses the site.

And as you have clearly missed the fact he stated "More welcome messages" referring to PM's received when signing up to sythe for the first time and NOT the encouragement of discussion.

Zip it up.

 

Reading carefully solves this problem. Too often are users hasty when it comes to trading and fail to realize who they are actually trading with.