Religion causes seperation, not happiness.

One god. Different Saviors.

I will shortly state my thesis... discuss from there and I will contribute to the argument as well.


Religion is the source of seperation and conflict. The world should eliminate the concept of religion, and just praise the only "god" that exists. Saviors are important, however, they are not important enough to cause so much tension in our world.
Religion is an excellent way to teach people concepts of what is good and bad, but our society can easily find other ways to teach our children how to act appropiately.

Discuss freely.




A note to the posters:
This is NOT a "does god exist?" thread, this is a "should religions exist?" topic. Thank you in advance for understanding =).

 

I agree, most wars and large scale conflicts are caused by some sort of religious disagreement. The Crusades for example. Although I dont believe in god Ill agree that religion can keep people in order, especially if they think a higher being will strike them down and they'll be rewarded in the end for leading a good religious filled life.

 

It's better to believe in something than to be so idiotic that whatever you write causes the brains of other to spontaneously combust from sheer overpowering ignorant assertions.

*deep breath*

I say....let the people have their hope.

 

Hang on... Are you saying that people who beleive contradictary things are all on the right track?

That's stupid. It's like saying a ham sandwhich is not only a ham sandwhich, but a slice of pizza as well.

 

What you just said doesn't even make sence...

Anyway, I think that religion isn't to blame. Just because a few ignorant fags can't tolerate others different opinions, doesn't mean it is religions fault.

 

I disagree on the contrary. Religon make civilizations far more complex and actually brings order to society. Like all religons tell you to be good, yadda yadda, etc.

 

I kinda agree with trust because what exactly do you think all the wars in the middle east are about now? Saddam and Osahma(could be spelled wrong) all think that their god wants America gone, so what do they do? Kill Americans. Im not saying we should completely do without religion, I mean for some people thats what they live for, my grandma for instance. If I was to say god dangitt or somthing of that sourt...she always has to say somthing to me about it. Some religions, I think are completely wrong, but thats not anything I can help.

 

I think we can all agree that religions define the lifestyle we live. They tell us what is good, and what is bad. That is the good side of religion.


However, the conflict spawns from religious and social intolerance that really should not exist. I have read some of the Qaran, and it has some of the most poetic passages I have ever read... however, then I see terrorists giving up their lives so they can somehow glorify their god... It just seems contradictory. By the way, this type of behavior is not only indicative of Islam... Christians, Hindus, and basically all other religions (except maybe Buddhists ) have used violence to try and "promote" their religion.


Religion should be a catalyst of peace... and close gaps in our society, not widen them.



Now to answer some of the responses:

To Shinoda- I didn't really comprehend the first sentence you said, but I do have a response to the second sentence... I say let the people have hope of an afterlife, but realize that everyone wants to go to "heaven" or whatever different religions call it. Most religions are essentially the same in the fact that if you live a good life, and try and promote your savior among others - you will go to "heaven", or its counterpart in other cultures. Acceptance of this fact is key if the whole concept of religion wishes to lose the conflict factor.

To x9- I am not sure I understand your argument at all, but let me clarify what my point is. Religion causes conflict where it should promote peace. Everyone believes that their religion is correct, but in that assumption comes the problem. The contradiction as you put it originates from people asserting that their religion is "better" or more "correct" than the next person's. This is why i sometimes think that religion should no longer exist, and that we should live on a general set of morals.

to billabong69- I agree with your point, but don't you also think that if religion didn't exist - none of these "ignorant fags" would have anything to dispute about?

To A Soul's Bounds- I have to disagree. If you look throughout history, religions have been the cause of many wars, and have basically been the cause of anything but order. Religions do teach you how to act, but I think there is a better way to teach our society what is right and what is wrong. Religion spills way too much blood for my liking.

And to blood_angel- I like your reasoning, and if everyone was as tolerant as you, I don't think our world would have an issue. I really liked your last sentence where you stated your opinion on other religions, but also realized that other people have opinions as well. I truly believe that our world needs to adapt a mindset similar to yours.



Still waiting for replies! Thanks to all the posters, and I hope you read my responses.

 

First, not every religion is based upon the idea of one God.

Second, good luck trying to convince Christians, Muslims, and Jews to forget their differences, and just worship God (the idea of Jesus being the Son of God is intrinsic to Christianity, so that wouldn't work...).

Third, this idea would assume that everyone in the world is sick of the conflict, agrees that there is one God, and wants to unify with their neighbors.

What about Atheists? I think some 10% of the U.S.'s population is Atheistic, do they just get lumped into the "one religion"?

This shouldn't happen. It would violate everybody's freedom of religion, and probably cause a couple more wars.

 

shredderbeam2,

I realize that getting rid of a religion can only be a theoretical idea. Also, I mentioned above (not in my previous post since I was only stating a short thesis), but in other posts that I was not refering to all religions, just most of them. To address your second and third points, I think that the removal of religion from society would force Christians, Muslims, and Jews to forget their differences. I think that if everyone realized just how similar our religions were, there would be hardly as much disputing as there is now. To address your fourth point, I point to the fact that I realize that not all religions would potentially be affected by this plan, simply because they do not follow the structure of the majority (live a good life and go to some sort of "heaven"). To address your third point, I would dare to argue that at least 95% of the world would be happy if there was less bloodshed. Fewer wars mean healthier families, where the father gets to be at home in most cases to help raise their children.

I respect your opinion, and I thoroughly realize that this wouldn't happen... but I truly believe that our society would be alot better off if we just lived by a set of general morals. Religious conflict has been going on for centuries now. I sometimes wonder why people haven't settled their differences (which in my opinion are few and far between) and stopped the violence.

 

I agree that it causes separation... the root of many wars are religion.

 

To GreenHorn3,

Glad to hear it =).


More posts are welcome.

 

Extremists always try to "change" or interpret differently the way the Quran is written. For example, some people think that the Quran says "If you kill Americans you go to heaven" because they see these extremists on the news acting like it. But if you think about it - that isn't even possible. Something extremists don't get - The Quran was written hundreds and hundreds of years before America was even there in the first place.

 

That works to an extent, but what happens when you've got millions of people who will vote in elections, and base thier political opinions on thier beliefe in hope, because they feel that they would be going against god if they didn't. It's not that all people want to, they do so out of fear of being shunned by the church.

A few? Evangelical Christians can nearly control the vote throughout the United States, and any single one would follow thier pastor to the word.

How does religion make a civilization more complex? Religion tells you to decide what is morally right or wrong, and if you want to be part of that religion you have to conform your moral beliefe's to that specific religion. If you believe that abortion is right, your church can go so for to kick you out for that belief.

 

I am muslim and i do not want that taken away from me. It gives me something to believe in and if i didnt have it.. why would i live? Secondly it makes me want to be good to get into heaven and be with god. Religion brings peace it is the extremist that seperate us.

 

Yeah. I agree on that. It is better to believe in something, than to believe in nothing. You'll probably be happier, with more hope, with happiness relating to your God, or whatever.

Religion causes happiness, and seperation. That's for sure. People have said they were happier, in a religion, better than being a plain old atheist. Wouldn't you rather be happier, looking foward to something, and thinking something divine, is out there, other than we were here, without a purpose, and just to live?

And yes, religion causes war, causes conflicts, causes seperation. But when did religion seperate us, today, and cause wars? I haven't heard anything about religion seperating us in the 21st century. Everyone has their own beliefs, and can believe in what they want...

 

I would say that life would be better without it. Richard Dawkins put it well:

 

I think that this thread has a common theme... the church and its doctrine control our morality. People don't want to leave the church in fear of being isolated... so this destructive path continues.

Personally, I believe in a God.. just not in a religion. I go to church, but I go hesitantly. I take lessons that I believe can be applied to my lifestyle and remember them. I do not listen to political discussions. Our churches find so many frivolous things to argue about that I frankly have become sick and tired of being sick and tired of hearing it.

To Spereff, I see your point. Religion causes happiness and seperation. But in my opinion, it causes more seperation. Also, you mentioned modern religious conflict. Do not be fooled. The Christian vs. Islam war still continues today, albeit incognito. This war on terrorism might as well be the Crusades reborn in my opinion.

To Shawn_, I agree with every point you made in your post. In America, we focus more on the foreign radicalism instead of the domestic. Some of our christians are just as bad as the Muslims that threaten to blow themselves up for their God.

To Doombringe1, Religion spawns extremists. This tale has been told for more than a millenium. I appreciate your idealistic views, but I feel that the only solution is too eradicate the root of the problem: religion itself.

More posts are welcome.

 

The 10 commandments. (the corner stone of the bible)

1. You shall have no other gods before me.
2. You shall not make for yourself a graven image.
3. You shall not take the name of the LORd your God in vain.
4. Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.
5. Honor your father and your mother.
6. Your shall not murder.
7. You shall not commit adultery.
8. You shall not steal.
9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
10. You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your neighbor's wofe, or his manservant, or his maidservant, or his ox, or his ass, or anything that is your neighbor's.

The first four of these injuctions have nothing wahtsoever to do with morality. As stated, they forbid the practice of any non-Judeo-Christian faith (like Hinduism_, most religous art, utterances like "God. damn it!", and all ordinary work on the Sabbath---all under penalty of death. We mgith well wonder how vital these precepts are to the maintenace of civilazation.

-Sam Harris, Letter to a Christian Nation.

There is more on commandments 5 through 9 but they are not needed in this thread.

 

Wtf? Wrong wrong wrong.
If they believe in God, why would they want to go against what they think God wants? There is something awfully wrong with talking about people who don't agree with ideas that their religion (or belief(s), rather) entails. A logical error.
People vote for people who are of the same religion because they know they have the same values and beliefs as they do. It's perfectly valid, and frankly, the best way to vote (if such a candidate is available). Please point out why this is not a good way to vote.

No kidding...
But religion isn't about this life... don't be foolish.
There is no good reason for war except for religion.
And Dawkins didn't put anything well... he's apparently more of an idiot than even I. You can't blame God because some morons do something in His name. How stupid is that?