Requiring Guide Verification

I suggest making a new rules requiring guide verification for 07 guides due to the fact people are just selling old public methods left and right. They don't own the guide nor is it new.

 

If someone wants to sell a runecrafting guide they wrote, they should be allowed to, as long as there is no intention in hiding what the guide is about.
I wrote a guide about selling mort myre fungi, then I figured everyone knew it, so I didn't bother anymore.
If I still wanted to sell the guide, I should be allowed to sell the guide under the premise I sell it as a Mort Myre Fungi Guide and not as a "Secret Method" to earn X amount of gold.

 

i support.
a friend of mine purchased a thieving guide...
all it said were to thieve npc's and said how much per hour you can achieve from doing so... even these prices were incorrect after a few hours of testing. >_<

 

Support, I know so many people that have been scammed by buying guides that can be found online for free

 

It doesn't work that way though. Everyone knows about morte myre fungi, if you wanted to sell a guide about it then it'd have to be a glitch or something. It is a public method and no one should be making money off public methods.

 

You cannot sell old guides.

You have to be the author of any ebook or have resale rights. You didnt create the guide, it is publicly available. It's taking advantage of people, really.

They have to be original or have some addons to a previous method.

 

But you aren't necessarily buying the method, you can just be buying the guide. Need it be a secret for a guide to be written about it?

I can assure you I have written that guide and it was original, if I wanted to sell it, I don't see why I should be prohibited from it. EDIT: As long as I am clear I am selling a mort myre fungi picking and selling guide.

 

Look plain and simple. If a seller's guide contains basically everything that a publicly available method/guide/ebook has, it cannot be sold unless there is your OWN twist/spin/add-ons to improve a certain aspect that is not publicly available.

 

That is a good rule for your elite dead section of verified guides:
http://www.sythe.org/runescape-verified-guides/

But it is not a good rule to impose to all guides. I believe what you just said is not true, I would like to see it written in any place.
Basically, if I wrote it, and I haven't published it, then it is not publicly availabe.

More specifically I have seen you are telling many guide sellers that only OGV team can verify guides, this is not true, I can give my guide to a mod and if he finds it suitable he will post positive feedback (even if he can't say the word "verifying" because he's not allowed to), this is in no way different from what the OGV team does (since official verification is not required.)

If you require all guides to be verified and to meet all the standards the OGV team proposes, then all you are really doing, is prohibiting the sales of guides that don't meet your standards or authors don't want to give away for free.

I thought the official verification of guides was supposed to be a helpful aid to sell and legitimize your guides, not a regulatory system.

If this rule were in place and I wanted to sell a glitch, I would be told that I am not allowed to sell the guide unless the OGV team verifies it, I wouldn't want 10 people knowing the method, therefore I am not allowed to sell it in sythe without leaking it.

 

You're confused with review copies and actual verification. The OGV is set to verify guides, to make sure they're not just some old guide that someones trying to sell as their own, to show the legitimacy of the guide as it will have Sythe's OGV team's official verification.

In other words it was created for that sole purpose, to leave mods to worry about the site and us about guides.

So you are wrong. Only OGV can verify guides and its a huge difference from a simple review. As reviews don't prove the guide is original only that it works and that can be any guide.

And verification can be required when reports are made that it can be found for free.

I am suggesting requiring verification for 07 guides due to the fact that most of these are publicly available. Meaning you have no right to profit off it unless you add something different that isn't public. I never said all guides I said I would want to but its unrealistic knowing how ebook sellers take advantage of not requiring verification to rip off the ignorant otherwise the section would be dead and a few seller would remain (honest ones) but I see the conflict of worrying about too many knowing.

Publicly available means it anywhere online that its accessible.
Not sure what youre saying about writing a guide and not posting it. :huh:

I know how people selling ebooks are, there are the legit ones that have rights or actually made it themselves and then there are those looking to sell free ebook/methods to the ignorant for quick cash.

Sythe's opening of a ebook section opened a door to immoral people ready to prey on the ignorant, excusing their sales by saying its the buyers fault for not knowing.

 

In that case, I am still against requiring verification. Sellers shouldn't be prohibited from selling a guide they made just because they don't want to leak it to the OGV team.
If you have reports of someone selling a method that is publicly available , then just ask the buyer to describe and link to the public method, then ask the seller if that is the method, tell him he is not allowed to sell that guide if it is, if he tells you that is not the method and he continues to sell the guide, then someone else will report the him and you will be able to ban him.

"But what if the other buyer doesn't report him?"
Well if he is satisfied with the guide, good for both of them. No need to regulate or meddle anything, there is no conflict.

"But what if the other buyer is unsatisfied and fills a scam report? It could have been avoided"
Not really, if he fills a scam report, that means he went first, the seller could have just as well given him an empty guide, or just not give him anything at all,the OGV job is done and will aid in the banning of the illegitimate seller by determining that the guide sold was just as good as an empty guide .

Not only I think requiring verification is unnecessary, it would also be detrimental to someone who wants to sell a guide but doesn't want to leak it.

In short, nothing should be banned from being sold unless it is illegal.
False advertisement would be considered illegal.
Restrictions as to what guides someone is prohibited to sell should be linked to what he claims when he sells the guide.
Someone who made a thread titled "Selling Guide 5$", should be entitled to sell whatever guide he wants, even if it is public knowledge, however ridiculous it sounds.
Someone who made a thread titled "Selling 1m p/h Public knowledge moneymaking guide" should be entitled to sell a guide even if it is of public knowledge.
In the same sense, someone who makes a thread where he sells a method and never reveals what it is in the thread, while being secretive of its requirements and details, then it is clear that his intentions are to sell the guide as a secret method. If proven public knowledge, you could argue that is false advertisement.
However if the seller is clear about the requirements and all the details before selling, then there would be no reason for someone to buy the guide if they know it (because they'd know they know it obviously) and there would be no reason for a buyer to complain about it (because he obviously didn't know what the method was), and I wouldn't see any reason to prohibit the seller from selling more guides as long as he is the author of the guide.

No support for requiring verification.

 

What you said is highly immoral and is exactly why I suggest 07 verification being required.



The whole point of OGV team is to stop scams before they happen, to avoid profits off public information. Its ludicrous to allow such immoral actions. Allowing to sell other peoples work especially public ones is stealing. Nothing more

Everything you listed is to protect ebook sellers profit no matter how wrong...

Its also obvious what intentions are when the user selling ebooks is completely new.

 

Would you care to let me know what part is immoral?
I am not trying to protect guide sellers profit, rather, the liberty of buyers and sellers to buy and sell what they want, as long as it is legal.

You also seem to believe that all ebooks contain or must contain secret information. Are we only allowed to sell ebooks and guides that contain secret information? If that is case, why are we banned from selling other ebooks?

 

I've stated clearly that it must not be public knowledge because that means you are not the author. Thats copyright and profiting of that is stealing. Hence why its not allowed. Period.

You're saying its okay for everything as long as there no complaints from the buyers which is wrong.

You seem to have a twisted way of thinking...

I already stated the facts, I don't know how you can think using others work as your own is okay but I won't re explain things to try convincing you.

 

That is wrong.
The fact that the information in a book is publicly available, does not mean that book is plaggiarism.
What do you find so immoral about someone selling something that isn't a secret?

However this discussion is irrelevant due to this resulting in one of this 2 unjust situations.
Seller is obliged to unwillingly leak guide to the team.
Seller is prohibited from selling the guide.

 

How can you still say its okay for anyone to sell public information for profit? That is plagiarism. You have to be kidding me...


Its not leaking if its public information it means its already out there. How can you leak something that's already public? LMFAO
If the guide is proven to abide by the rules it gets verification. Theres nothing to fear if you're guide isn't ripped or against the rules.

If its not his, yeah no shit. Its called stealing. We stop these things, hence why the OGV team exist.

You are the perfect example of how bad people come here to take advantage and sell guides/methods that aren't yours. Thanks for proving my point.

I hope this get the attention it deserves. I'm sorry but you keep repeating the same illogical argument that anyone has the right to resale anything even free information for the sole purpose of profit and you're saying it's wrong of us to stop such immoral actions?

This is exactly what I said, those who know they're selling something that is not theirs defends not verifying because it would get them banned.

Hence the abundance of newcomers or untrusted members selling old guides.

 

It has been done a billion times and no one complains about it:
http://www.amazon.com/The-Merriam-W...TF8&qid=1364035980&sr=8-1&keywords=dictionary

You don't know if it's a public method or not when you force him to submit it to verification, that would be the whole idea.
I have tried to given a variety of examples ranging from secret to public guides, legal or ilegal. But all you say is "They don't write the guide, it's public information, it's copyright infringement", you are automatically assuming all guides are and will be like this, if that'd be the case, this suggestion would be a good idea, an even better idea would be not to allow ebooks sales.

Do you realize how offensive you are?
I have done nothing wrong or immoral, I have sold nothing that didn't belong to me.
Also, methods don't have ownership, guides do.

 

1st part: If you're not a troll you sure are something else....

The thing is, almost all 07 guides are public, they LITERALLY GOOGLE(YOUTUBE) search "runescape 2007 money making guides" or a variance of those keywords. Then come here and sell it. Which is not allowed, its on freaking youtube/google meaning publicly available. Unless they add a twist or an improvement to that existing method/guide/ebook, it is not allowed.

So its not an assumption its a fact about 07 guides. Thats why I brought this up.

Offensive? You just defended people selling ebooks/guides/methods that can be found online for free, profiting of the work of others and of the ignorant. So no its not an offensive statement, its a simply a statement. You defending immoral actions as justified and instead antagonize the OGV team.

Not much sense.

Methods are the guides/ebooks...:huh: Its not much different.

Look you keep repeating the same thing, over and over saying it is OK to take something free and turn around and sell it.

We already shared our input and it seems it will go no where. I will not respond to another one of your posts.


I hope members actually get involved in this.

PS
I actually did mention to Sythe that this section would bring bad people. I was right. Then they created the OGV team, I criticized them as well for not doing their job as I went buying guides to prove people were selling public methods/guides/ebooks. I also found out about rstrader selling an article flipping guide which was "verified" at the time so I bought it and was outraged that it wasn't denied. I saved several people their money.

The leader at the moment rejected my guide that made several people hundreds out of spite. Once he left I was invited to help out. So I am here now.

I am an ebook/guide seller and have been for years on other sites. never selling anything but my own works or twists. I know the business and I know what kind of people are in it to make some quick buck without writing anything themselves.

I am simply trying to avoid people wasting money and avoid immoral people making a profit of something thats not theirs.

 

I cannot fathom why you wouldn't want a discussion over a suggestion you are evidently so interested in.

A method of moneymaking in runescape can never have any ownership (other than jagex). A guide/ebook can.

If the guide contains secret unknown information, then the seller will still be profiting from the ignorance of the buyer, I see nothing wrong with that.

Also, you seem pretty fervent about defending intellectual property, while you are on a sythe that frequently condones infringement of jagex' intellectual property. It seems like a weird thing to punish a user for, rather than punishing for copyright infringement (unless it is literal copying) the usual wrongdoing is, false advertisement or deceit if not outright scamming (as in, not giving any guide).

I'm not trying to protect the people who are secretive about what their guide is, lie about the returns, cash per hour, I'm sure they do not need googled guides to scam, they could just scam.

I am just saying, you do not need a silly prohibitive rule requiring for every guide to be verified to regulate these guides, you just need to prove that the claims they make when selling it (public? details? cash per hour? requirements?) were fake, and then ban the user.

 

We did discuss and you don't make any points that you havent tried making in all of your posts. You're only saying that anything is ok until it is evident that the guides are in fact freely available which results in several users likely to have purchased it and not getting their money back.

I'm trying to avoid it, even though it has already begun.

Again I am talking about 07 guides specifically as most of those guides are just dug up because 07 RS is back. They have no right to resell them. This is what I meant by the google/youtube search which you

It is evident that these are in fact not theirs but avoid verification because our job is too make sure it does what is says but more importantly that it is not online to the public and rather get "reviews" knowing people love free stuff.

Yet you clearly defend selling public methods and you just stated again that we shouldn't care. I am done talking to you. You have blatantly stated that stealing someones guides shouldn't matter as long as it is sold to those who are ignorant. The discussion is not about simply scamming but ripping FREE guides to sell.

:noworry:

Off to bed.