Wipes While Holding Gold (MM'ing)

Since when are the MM's responsible? Every time I ever MM'ed gold while wipes were hot, me & both of the traders discussed it, and they pretty much mutually agreed that I wasn't responsible.

Can somebody explain the logic to me behind it? I personally just don't get it.

 

Yeah I just MM'd a trade myself and mid trade while I was holding the cash I saw the new announcement and semi shit myself. I don't believe this should be the case although there could be things like people claiming the gold was wiped when they stole it, etc.

 

It was put in placed a while ago when Jagex started to do wipes. It only recently came up again due to the large amount of wipes occurring. The reason for the MM to be responsible has 2 answers:

1) The MM could claim he was wiped while holding the gp and essentially scam the person.
2) The MM is there to make the trade safer, if he was the cause of the wipe he didn't do his job and the responsibility falls on him.

 

I wish we weren't responsible and that it was put on the trader to use their own discretion in the first place. Personally I will most likely never MM large trades because I am scared to get wiped and be held responsible for something I wasn't profiting on in the first place.

 

Yeah I think I may take a break from MMing at all until this blows over and Jagex go back to not giving a fuck again. I don't want to be held responsible when I am giving up my own time to help people trade safely.

 

If so, they should know the risks of gold being wiped.

 

Seems the only ways to prove their innocence if such an event occured would be video footage of the entire ordeal, which seems drastic for MM's to cover their own backs.

 

I feel that MMs should already be recording their entire trades and the rule is that if they have indisputable footage that they got wiped, their fine. The only thing I advice against is to mm trades that take more than a day (impossible to record your screen that long). IMO the rule is fair.

 

I think everyone who does a deal on Sythe or any other site should record there trade. This makes it easier to post one single video of a scam then it is to deal with images, uploading them all, posting a bunch of information when the video could show everything and would not lie.

To be honest I think if it was a mandatory thing for atleast MM's then scams around here would drop insanely.

 

mm.... mixed fealings about this, i guess if you plan on MM'ing don't do it unless you have a steady job =\

 

We don't really have any other choice or there would be a lot of fake roll backs with people running off with gold.

 

What if it's in my TOS? n4n0 once told me if I'm recording I'm fine and I don't have to pay... ok good. But there are trades that simply can't be recorded...

I mean, if users agree to my TOS, I shouldn't be held responsible then. This leaves a window open to scam, but, seriously, re-paying $100+ for something we haven't done is shit.

I always choose best account to MM and hold gold depending on trade. But if we are working towards users safety and we got wiped on a 2 day trade, why would we have to pay?

 

I haven't been wiped in a long time, but I do remember one thing, which should prove innocence over the MM being accused..

When you are being wiped (if the trade is immediate, this will come into effect), you are immediately disconnected and when you try to sign in, you get an error message.

I'm pretty sure that error message only comes about when you are wiped.

 

I agree with you Punker,
Honestly even if both traders DID'NT agree that you weren't responsible;
It's still the risk of the business..
Middlemen shouldn't be responsible, especially if they do it for free.

On the other hand, had it been their first, or within their first few trades
I myself wouldn't believe their innocence.

 

What happens when a middleman just claims it got wiped, banks it, and screenshots an empty inventory? Or transfers it to another account?

If you don't want the risk, then don't middleman long-term trades.

 

I will be closing this when I get home if someone else doesn't. Holding the middleman responsible prevents scams where the mm "claims" that he was wiped when he really wasn't. Also, the purpose off a mm is to make the trade safer. Him or her being wiped just completely negated the purpose of a mm and is they will be held responsible for the amount lost, UNLESS there is a mutual agreement and understanding between the buyer and seller and the mm beforehand. If buyer and seller want to risk the loss, then they are allowed to do so.

 

Will post a more in depth reply later as well. I'm currently on my phone.

 

Locked.

 

Alright. To caveat off of my previous posts.

MM's will be held responsible for any and all wipes that occur. This is to prevent scams where the MM claims they were wiped, when in reality, they were not. This is merely a precaution.

IF the participants in the trade wish. I personally see no harm in an agreement between the 3 parties (Buyer, Seller, and MM) that exempts the MM from responsibility of a wipe. This will be purely a case-by-case basis, and will NOT be accepted in a MM's ToS. Don't even try.

Buyer, Seller, and MM MUST agree (and have screenshot evidence) of such an agreement. In this case and in this case ONLY will the MM be "pardoned" per se for a wipe if it were to happen.


Also - In response to TBT's post. If you're recording, and the reset takes place DURING THE TRADE, and DURING the recording (ex. You're booted off the account. You log back in, and the RSGP/item(s) are gone) - Exceptions may be made in this case.

 

Exactly what N4N0 said.

I was MMing and lost a purple phat, I paid it back (as I was hacked).

Louis had a similar situation and refused to pay back so he's still banned.