Retry

Unfortunately my last thread was closed by FireZ due to the fact that he believed that it was a "waste of time" and that it was "going in circles", which is of course because the staff refuse to participate. I can debate with other members all day, but it's the staff participation that matters. Instead of closing the thread to try and silence it, I wish that you would engage in the discussion. I do not wish to hurt feelings, and I do not wish to put people down. I hope that I am not silenced any further. So here I will repost my thread, and if you want to read any replies to this thread please look at my original post: http://sythe.org/showthread.php?t=1428326

Hello everyone, it’s me again. Yea yea I know, “l0l noob I new u’d be back”, and yes I am, but only for my last little hoo-rah. Since I’ve left I have been lurking on other sites similair to sythe such as, d2jsp, ownedcore, and powerbot, and my biggest fears for sythe were realized. Sythe is lightyears behind in forum tech and activity. It made me realize that not only was I right about sythe never growing, but we are falling behind as well. How can we expect to compete with forums that have double, or even triple our activity? I am going to do my best to outline every problem I can think of, and hopefully people will finally open their minds instead of continuing to block out everything negative they hear. Please do not post until you have read everything I have to say, and only if it is constructive.

I. Admins
My last thread was mainly concerned with the Admins. I believe I outlined my main feelings about them, and unfortunatley it did not end well. Not only did only 2 of them even acknowledge the feedback, but they completely refused to even take it into consideration. That is the first main problem, threads such as mine are all handled the same way. Instead of talking to the OP, the accused will point out the smallest flaw and blow it up. Even if has almost nothing to do with the main idea, the flaw will be taken and stretched to the point where the accused can then say that everything the OP says is stupid and wrong. For example in my thread (http://sythe.org/showthread.php?t=1423659) I put across a majority of main ideas, and then somehow I was being brought down by the fact that I don’t know every little detail about how plugins effect the vulnerability of Sythe. Pretty specific huh? It’s kind of funny considering that was such a small part of my topic. Well that’s how things work, which leads to the next step of the process.

After a flaw has been found, that’s when all the lackies come on board. Once that flaw has been found, every single member who wants to prove themselves to the staff will instantly be against the OP. Essentially, the OP is bullied to the point where they are forced to give up. An example of this (http://sythe.org/showthread.php?t=1409487) . Perhaps the OP was wrong in how he approached the subject, and that can be expected considering it takes a while to become an expert in sythe policies, but his general idea was based on his experience. His post was based on what he had experienced, and what he had felt, yet the people who responded to him, insisted that he was wrong. Wrong. Apparently, people’s opinions can be wrong. I’ve noticed that’s not how things work around here. Unless you are a high ranking, well known member of the community, you’re opinion is wrong, and the staff’s opinion is right. This leads to what we have now, a staff feedback thread full of virtual high-fives, and pats on the back, and absolutley nothing negative is tolerated, which opens up all of the other problems I am going to get into.

One of these problems, as I talked about in my other thread is admin activity. Other than Finn, no other admin has been overwhelmingly active. I have heard the excuses a million times over, “admins have jobs”, “admins have to work”, “Sythe is no-ones first priority”, well that’s all well and good, but it’s not helping anyone. Countless times I have heard that admin’s aren’t required to be very active, but why not? Maybe that’s Richard’s fault for instilling that policy. Inactive admin’s may do the job, but really, are they helping anything? Sure they can do the job, but I guarantee there are plenty of people who can do the same exact things, and would be active at it as well. If you have a full time job, and don’t have the time to give to sythe, or don’t feel the need to give time to sythe, then you shouldn’t be an admin. Plain and simple. Admin’s are the highest of authorities, and yet they think they don’t need to do anything outside of the listed requirements. I also find it ironic that the general admins are stripped of many admin permissions because Matthew and/or Richard feel that they will “break” things. That is just ridiculous, if you don’t trust someone in the position, then why are they there? Richard, Matthew, and Govind are the “tech experts”, so they get all the permissions. Why? I may not know the extent of it, but if someone is an admin, they should atleast have the ability to do things admins do, such as give out a rank. This is especially important considering the “tech experts” do not feel they need to be present at all. That leaves us with 3 admins, who may put some activity forward, but what are they really other than some less active, glorified globals.

What do I propose to do about this? Make Govind/Matthew soley the tech experts, having them in the admin position just makes the admin group more crowded, which leaves people with the feeling that there are too many admins. That is of course unless they decide to start become more active. I understand your skills are necessary, and very beneficial, but unless you’re going to fill the entire role, don’t bother. Next, require the current general admins to be a part of the community. If you can’t do things the other admins can do, then what is your role? Handing out bans, closing threads? Sounds like a global’s job to me. If you’re not going to have the power to do other things, then what’s the point of having you? It would be very good for everyone if the admins were more involved. Participate in contests, post around more, do your best to support and grow the community. That’s what you need to do. Don’t sit back and just do the minimum requirements, you’re not helping anyone by doing that, there are plenty of people who can do that. If you have a job and can’t do that, then resign, you’re not helping anyone by doing what you’re doing. As I have said a million and one times, the admin role is a huge role to fill on a forum, so if you can’t fill it, you’re not doing anyone a favor by doing only what’s required of you.

I’d like to hope that instead of just doing the bully-until-it-dies tactic you will take this all into consideration.

II. Forum Tech
Lately, as I stated in my opening paragraph, I have been browsing other forums similair to sythe such as powerbot and ownedcore. I can honestly say I was blown away by how much sythe is lacking, and how far it is behind other forums. One can compare powerbot to Sythe and see how horribly behind Sythe is. (Please don’t bring up the people on powerbot because that is not what we are discussing, and I know it’s going to be one of those nitpicky points that people will try to use to make me out to be “wrong” in my opinion). The overall styles and features far surpass sythe. For example, a simple feature such as the bump timer:



Think about how big of a problem bumping is on Sythe, and think of how a majority, maybe not all, but a majority of those problems could be avoided by using something as simple as that feature.

Another feature we could talk about is the feedback system. It always confounds me as to why everyone is so against it. I think it’s probably because at some point someone said no, and so from now on everyone will defend to their grave that descision. Why? Well because a staff member said so. Why do ebay, amazon, and many other big market websites use a feedback system? Because it works. It keeps things organized an proffesional. So why is Sythe so against it? It goes back to my point from before, it has been denied at some point, and so it will never happen. Everyone is convinced that our system works, and so it doesn’t need to be changed. These are just a few of the features that sythe is lacking on. There are plenty more things that could be added to make things run better.
On my previous thread I was told:

You know what that is? Lazy. Lazy, and ridiculous. This is directed towards the “tech admins”, if you think something is going to be a vulernability, then you work to protect it. Avoiding adding new things because you don’t want to put the time and effort into protecting it is just plain ridiculous. How can you expect to grow without change or adding things? There are plenty of features that the site could benefit from, and if you want to avoid those because it could open up a vulnerability that you should be protecting, because that is your sole job after all, then why are you on Sythe? If you don’t care, and you don’t want to help it grow, then why are you here? WHY is Sythe being run by people who simply don’t care! It’s mind boggling, and extremely frustrating.

You can look at the VB4 upgrade as another example. VB4 brings many changes that are highly beneficial to the forum, and why don’t we have it yet? Because no one wants to put in the effort to making it happen. 3-4 months ago we heard “it’s almost done”, yeah well, that’s all well and good, but where is it? If you want to continue growing and flourshing, you have to put the effort in, or atleast put someone in charge who will.

III. Effects & Conclusion
I continue to stand by what I said before, Sythe is in a never ending state of limbo. We neither decline, nor grow. People move on, and new people come in, but really, we never grow. Eventually that will end. What happens when the runescape market, or runescape in general, dies? People can say it never will happen, but eventually it will. What will we have left over? People will leave in droves and sythe could collapse. How do we stop that, we grow the community. If we grow a community that is big enough to sustain far more than just runescape, well then we have a much more successful, much more profitable, and much more sustainable forum. Sure we can just stay where we are, and be in the constant state of limbo, but why not grow? I guarantee that when Sythe started, as any other forum does, the staff and the userbase did their best to put time, energy, and effort into making the site grow. I am an administrator on a new, growing forum, and I can see first hand right now all that is put into the site. We, the staff, and the userbase, are doing everything we can to grow, and it’s working. We don’t think “Eh what we have works”, we think “What we have is good, but how can it be better”. The lack of that feeling on Sythe is all to prevalent. We should be doing what we can to grow, so that instead of being like this:



We can be like this:



I want everyone to see that I am not trying to be the bad guy here. Why would I put this much time and effort into this if I just wanted to spite someone. PLEASE just take what I have into consideration, I have no interest in debating why my opinion is right or wrong, I just want to do my best to help the site grow. This is my last little hoo-rah, and maybe this time around it will work.

 

Your previous thread was closed by an Admin with a request. Why repost this...

Also, the staff were willing to participate... but this is not a suggestions thread, this is a feedback thread.

 

I do not consider closing my thread to silence me as participation.

 

There's the problem... He's not silencing you. Every one of the staff has told you the same thing, and still you refuse to make a little change to A) the location of your suggestions B) the way you state them.

If you did that, they would have no problem and everyone would be able to support it like they do...

 

Every one of the staff....hmm...I count 1 angry global, and 1 angry admin who closed my thread. If you would like a list of my suggestion, please refer to this thread: http://sythe.org/showthread.php?t=1428326

 

I know where they are... why ignore this - A) the location of your suggestions B) the way you state them

If you did this, there would be no problems.

 

Let's look at what will happen:

>I create a list
>1. Admins should be more active and work towards the progression of sythe
>"Oh my god you don't have any examples or details or reasoning at all, denied"
>I add reasons
>"Omg this is to long and complicated just make a list"
>Repeat


Arguing with people like you is the reason this thread is going in circles. I can argue with you all night, but it won't change anything. I want the people I am giving feedback to to participate in this thread, and not simply ignore it until it goes way. Then we won't be going in circles, will be furthering the discussion. I have nothing else to say to you Wolfdog, i've explained my logic a thousand times, and if you don't want to accept that, then please go make a thread of your own outlining what you think should be done.

 

I support this whole heartedly and I really hope that this opens some eyes but at this point I don't think people want change and the fact that FireZ locked it makes it painfully obvious. No one is proactively pushing forward, at least that is visible and transparent to normal members, because the staff can say SL and behind the scenes. Behind The Scenes has just become an excuse for us to not get a definitive answer for legitimate questions just like they were using the 'When vB4' comes out to delay things. I don't want to offend everyone but it seems like when it comes to the progress of Sythe everyone puts it on the backburner and says 'It's working' instead of 'What can we do to make it better?' That is the way I see things, and it could be false because I am not fully informed on 'behind the scenes' stuff but it's just an opinion and feedback that I feel is relevant.

 

I support this idea, simple things like this will cut back on all of the spam, along with mods taking up their time doing spammer reports when they could be tending to other issues.

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To add with x339's statement on growth; I personally love the community we have, however we don't have much option for growth. Bigger communities are fun, better for debates, answering questions, life support, etc. Nothing is bad with growing our community.

Earlier someone mentioned that Sythe is mainly for RuneScape users, which is true. We have a multi base community; D3, Xbox, WoW, etc.. However we don't attract those users. We need to be exploring advertisement options, being bannered on gold selling websites and such.

No one other then the current users want to come to a website that has no sort of change the way we do. We're the same community we have been years ago.

Most gold websites also sell gold for other MMORPG, RPG, games; D3, WoW, LoL.. If we were bonded to any of them "Offering our space for theres" this would bring in a huge new user base.

This is a pain in the butt to type on an iPhone...

Back to topic, we should be in other IRC servers with a #Sythe channel, servers primarily for WoW, D3.

Websites advertise for other websites if the offer is good enough, we have good enough features, our RuneScape community is one of the biggest out there, start with that and expand.

 

This is the FEEDBACK Forum, If you wish to make A SUGGESTION, then post it in the SUGGESTIONS forum.