Sythe     Register     FAQ     Members List     Calendar     Mark Forums Read    
 
Sythe  
  
Just to Clarify
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old 02-28-2012, 12:07 PM
Alteranz's Avatar
Hero
Zombie Angelic Retired Global Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: New Zealand
Referrals: 2
Posts: 5,068
 
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Okay, so before we go anywhere and get in a full-blown (not to mention unnecessary) argument with each other - how about those that are complaining/inquiring/questioning the spamming as well as excessive bumping rule propose viable solutions to the matter at hand rather than point out flaws in the System that us Moderators did our best to create.

Our goal on the staff team was to create an even trading ground as well as environment for ALL members of the community - these efforts were not to punish nor target you R2 (and others) but to simply give the smaller traders and sellers a chance in the market.

The solution must take every facet of the community into account, and be something that does not favor you top dogs. I understand this will be hard as your decisions and reasoning revolves around personal gain/profit as opposed to the good of the community - but if you are pushing for change, then make a proposal for change, not a rant.

Last edited by Alteranz : 02-28-2012 at 12:08 PM.
Copy this message to clipboard
  #22  
Old 02-28-2012, 12:45 PM
kmjt's Avatar
-.- The nocturnal life chose me -.-
Cracker Head Retired Sectional Moderator kmjt Donor
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Check your mother's bed
Referrals: 8
Posts: 12,989
 
Extreme Homosex RsProd Pokémon Trainer OG Club <3 n4n0 Heidy
Default Re: Just to Clarify

I did in fact make a proposal if you bothered to read my whole post. Never mind if that wasn't addressed at me.

Cosrob until those are added in and set in stone there is always going to be confusion. As it is the confusion > "people that don't bother reading it" and the confusion is exactly what is getting people infractions, although I guess if you say your 700 spam reports say otherwise I will have to take your word.

You can't just assume that because we vouch for them hours after they vouched for us that we are trying to manipulate the system. I always vouch people when they ask me to. Many people will come back and ask me for a vouch hours, even days after a completed transaction, and many big sellers can attest for this. So I simply decline their request for me to vouch them?

Another thing. People like having vouches in main threads (not vouch forum thread) because it shows that persons' future buyers/sellers that they have transacted with me. Not to mention once again that many people do not have vouch threads in the vouch forum, they request a vouch in my own thread for their future reference.

Quote:
Also, does somebody really care that they didn't a whole post to themselves for a vouch? Like, honestly, if that's your biggest problem - look yourself in the mirror and ask a few hard questions.
Personally? No I don't care. But I can tell you there is that odd person in the bunch, and even though that person is odd that would be one too many sales to lose if I in any way had a negative impact on that person. I cater to my customers. I give them what they want, I tell them what they want to hear. In exchange they give me their business and i'm grateful for it. But in the end i'm here to take their money and I use my legitimate business techniques to do so. You may not think these little things mean anything but to some people they do. Stop thinking like you and think like your customers. Just because you don't like eating metal doesn't mean others don't. Stupid? Yeah. But theres always odd people.

Maybe you are a bit confused as to what I mean by the double post double vouch scenario. I would never have 2 consecutive vouch posts in my thread (double posting). But say theres a post by some stranger after the first vouch, or many for that matter. Don't you find it odd for me to go back a couple of posts just to edit in another vouch because the customer didn't think until now to ask for the vouch?

Cosrob thank you for taking the time to read and reply.
__________________
Copy this message to clipboard
  #23  
Old 02-28-2012, 01:15 PM
We are all Witnesses
$200 USD Donor New Competition Winner
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: United Kingdom
Referrals: 1
Posts: 1,808
Send a message via MSN to Kenpen Send a message via Skype™ to Kenpen
 
Wait, do you not have an Archer rank? <3 n4n0
Default Re: Just to Clarify

To R2, Nope that was not needed at all, And the Pm System and so on exist for a reason, When he refreshes the page a pm will pop up, There's no guarantee he will go back to the same thread, That post was not needed at all and was just you trying to get a free bump in there.
Copy this message to clipboard
  #24  
Old 02-28-2012, 02:04 PM
Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Referrals: 28
Posts: 12,699
 
Off Topic Participant Community Participant
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alteranz View Post
Okay, so before we go anywhere and get in a full-blown (not to mention unnecessary) argument with each other - how about those that are complaining/inquiring/questioning the spamming as well as excessive bumping rule propose viable solutions to the matter at hand rather than point out flaws in the System that us Moderators did our best to create.
They have.

I have to agree with R2 and the such on this one. The bumping rule we have now is there for absolutely no reason. We have a bumping rule to keep the section sane, so that it does not turn into the RS forums where you bump every 5 minutes. This also keeps your post count down which is simply an added benefit. Adding more to the rule about answering questions and not simply sticking with a no double posting rule doesn't do anything more. It doesn't make it more fair. Small sellers still get less business than large sellers and thus their threads get bumped less. Should we make it so that only thread starters can post and all trades need to be done by PM to make sure that small sellers have exactly the same chance of having their thread on the top of the forum as large sellers? Well, if you really actually want to make it fair and equal for everyone, that's the only way to do it, so that's what I propose. Or just make it fair and go back to a simple double posting rule because adding more to that gets you nothing except for more infractions and annoyance.

Edit:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenpen View Post
To R2, Nope that was not needed at all, And the Pm System and so on exist for a reason, When he refreshes the page a pm will pop up, There's no guarantee he will go back to the same thread, That post was not needed at all and was just you trying to get a free bump in there.
You can not know what his motives are for posting and stating he is doing it for bad reasons, without any real proof of the matter, is just being aggressive and offensive for no reason.
__________________
I do not MM or trade anything.
Anyone claiming to be me in a trade or MM is an imposter.

LTY1DzST8DUxAMN8KLpKhG88vx4uNQpX4a
1NpgTisxVB5HKRVtTAtRmQJr6iRGrBXwUj

Last edited by SuF : 02-28-2012 at 02:06 PM.
Copy this message to clipboard
  #25  
Old 02-28-2012, 02:41 PM
Alteranz's Avatar
Hero
Zombie Angelic Retired Global Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: New Zealand
Referrals: 2
Posts: 5,068
 
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Quote:
Originally Posted by kmjt View Post
I did in fact make a proposal if you bothered to read my whole post. Never mind if that wasn't addressed at me.
No, don't worry it was addressed at others. It just frustrates me to see members create nonconstructive threads and push for change without proposing any possible changes. Hopefully from this point we're all just able to work together
Copy this message to clipboard
  #26  
Old 02-28-2012, 03:36 PM
Devils Advocate
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: England
Referrals: 6
Posts: 5,719
 
Default Re: Just to Clarify

I am not in favour of changing the rule, those who fail to adapt to it will be punished, and even if we do change it, you'll end up complaining about it again anyway when you get infracted and ask for a change again.
Copy this message to clipboard
  #27  
Old 02-28-2012, 04:25 PM
Hero
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Netherlands
Referrals: 5
Posts: 5,329
Send a message via MSN to just un dude Send a message via Skype™ to just un dude
 
Default Re: Just to Clarify

I'm also not in favour of changing the rule.

But as I've discussed with punjabi before, the rule should be clarified more simply and say something like 'A second post in 8 hours regardless of the contents is not allowed'.
Copy this message to clipboard
  #28  
Old 02-28-2012, 06:27 PM
kmjt's Avatar
-.- The nocturnal life chose me -.-
Cracker Head Retired Sectional Moderator kmjt Donor
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Check your mother's bed
Referrals: 8
Posts: 12,989
 
Extreme Homosex RsProd Pokémon Trainer OG Club <3 n4n0 Heidy
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl View Post
I am not in favour of changing the rule, those who fail to adapt to it will be punished, and even if we do change it, you'll end up complaining about it again anyway when you get infracted and ask for a change again.
Care to explain why you aren't in favour instead of out right rejecting it? We're here to have a discussion not to be left in the air and back to square one. For all I know your reasoning can be good. But you seem to base a lot of things on assumption, which isn't fair to us.


Quote:
Originally Posted by just un dude View Post
I'm also not in favour of changing the rule.

But as I've discussed with punjabi before, the rule should be clarified more simply and say something like 'A second post in 8 hours regardless of the contents is not allowed'.
Regardless of content? So no confirming in thread requests?


Veterans should be promoted instead of punished by this "fair for everyone" system. We have been here the longest to prove ourself, and all of us had to go through the same process to get to where we are so it was fair. This is one of the only forums I don't see promoting veteran sellers. Most forums give you a sticky option if you are a reputable seller and willing to pay a fee. Even playerauctions puts their veteran shops at the top of the list and promotes them on their homepage.
__________________
Copy this message to clipboard
  #29  
Old 02-28-2012, 06:50 PM
Hero
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Netherlands
Referrals: 5
Posts: 5,329
Send a message via MSN to just un dude Send a message via Skype™ to just un dude
 
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Yep, like I said regardless of the contents.

Anything posted on the thread can be communicated through PM instead or for example msn if you have that already. A verification that you're talking to someone can also just be pmed, including the e-mail adress you're talking from and partial conversation.

Last edited by just un dude : 02-28-2012 at 06:50 PM.
Copy this message to clipboard
  #30  
Old 02-28-2012, 06:51 PM
kmjt's Avatar
-.- The nocturnal life chose me -.-
Cracker Head Retired Sectional Moderator kmjt Donor
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Check your mother's bed
Referrals: 8
Posts: 12,989
 
Extreme Homosex RsProd Pokémon Trainer OG Club <3 n4n0 Heidy
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Quote:
Originally Posted by just un dude View Post
Yep, like I said regardless of the contents.

Anything posted on the thread can be communicated through PM instead or for example msn if you have that already. A verification that you're talking to someone can also just be pmed, including the e-mail adress you're talking from and partial conversation.
You assume that everyone knows what a PM is.
__________________
Copy this message to clipboard
  #31  
Old 02-28-2012, 06:56 PM
Hero
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Netherlands
Referrals: 5
Posts: 5,329
Send a message via MSN to just un dude Send a message via Skype™ to just un dude
 
Default Re: Just to Clarify

I assume everyone can read when it says you have a private message, yes.
Copy this message to clipboard
  #32  
Old 02-28-2012, 07:36 PM
Emperor_Nero's Avatar
Hero
$5 USD Donor New
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Referrals: 1
Posts: 6,767
 
Off Topic Participant Spam Forum Participant Community Participant GFX Forum Participant
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl View Post
I am not in favour of changing the rule, those who fail to adapt to it will be punished, and even if we do change it, you'll end up complaining about it again anyway when you get infracted and ask for a change again.
I have a to agree with Karl, and anyone who has been here for a few months will know that this same thread has been made about the bump rule three times - all for different bump rules. Each time the bump rule gets revised and then the thread gets made again. Why don't we just make it extremely unfair and sticky all of the major gold shops? There has to be some sort of compromise but if you are always complaining and not constructively suggesting revisions then there will be no compromise.
__________________

Some can gaze and not be sick,
But I could never learn the trick.
There's this to say for blood and breath,
They give a man a taste for death.


Subnormal nonentity
Copy this message to clipboard
  #33  
Old 02-28-2012, 07:38 PM
Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Referrals: 28
Posts: 12,699
 
Off Topic Participant Community Participant
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl View Post
I am not in favour of changing the rule, those who fail to adapt to it will be punished, and even if we do change it, you'll end up complaining about it again anyway when you get infracted and ask for a change again.
That's an unfair assumption.

Quote:
Originally Posted by just un dude View Post
Yep, like I said regardless of the contents.

Anything posted on the thread can be communicated through PM instead or for example msn if you have that already. A verification that you're talking to someone can also just be pmed, including the e-mail adress you're talking from and partial conversation.
So we are making the market impossibly hard to use which in turn will drive new members away from our forums for what exactly?

Edit:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor_Nero View Post
I have a to agree with Karl, and anyone who has been here for a few months will know that this same thread has been made about the bump rule three times - all for different bump rules. Each time the bump rule gets revised and then the thread gets made again. Why don't we just make it extremely unfair and sticky all of the major gold shops? There has to be some sort of compromise but if you are always complaining and not constructively suggesting revisions then there will be no compromise.
The bumping rule has been questioned so many times recently because it has been the exact same awful rule with different wording. Before it got changed to this, no one had an issue with it other than changing the amount of time now and then.
__________________
I do not MM or trade anything.
Anyone claiming to be me in a trade or MM is an imposter.

LTY1DzST8DUxAMN8KLpKhG88vx4uNQpX4a
1NpgTisxVB5HKRVtTAtRmQJr6iRGrBXwUj

Last edited by SuF : 02-28-2012 at 07:40 PM.
Copy this message to clipboard
  #34  
Old 02-28-2012, 07:42 PM
kmjt's Avatar
-.- The nocturnal life chose me -.-
Cracker Head Retired Sectional Moderator kmjt Donor
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Check your mother's bed
Referrals: 8
Posts: 12,989
 
Extreme Homosex RsProd Pokémon Trainer OG Club <3 n4n0 Heidy
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Quote:
Originally Posted by just un dude View Post
I assume everyone can read when it says you have a private message, yes.
Can you assume everyone has sythe? No. Many ghost viewers are customers and are unable to view private messages because they have no sythe account. Posting a snippet of our convo on msn in my thread is the only way to confirm its me to them.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor_Nero View Post
I have a to agree with Karl, and anyone who has been here for a few months will know that this same thread has been made about the bump rule three times - all for different bump rules. Each time the bump rule gets revised and then the thread gets made again. Why don't we just make it extremely unfair and sticky all of the major gold shops? There has to be some sort of compromise but if you are always complaining and not constructively suggesting revisions then there will be no compromise.
We have given our suggestions.
__________________
Copy this message to clipboard
  #35  
Old 02-28-2012, 07:58 PM
Hero
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Netherlands
Referrals: 5
Posts: 5,329
Send a message via MSN to just un dude Send a message via Skype™ to just un dude
 
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Quote:
Originally Posted by kmjt View Post
Can you assume everyone has sythe? No. Many ghost viewers are customers and are unable to view private messages because they have no sythe account. Posting a snippet of our convo on msn in my thread is the only way to confirm its me to them.
How hard is it to read an msn adress? If you were hacked, you would be responsible for the losses from your customers anyway.
Also, guests who view your thread can't be added by imposters, they can't post their msn.. so that's out of the question.

And I'm sure your sythe account would be hacked or banned aswell, but whatever that's a different subject.

Last edited by just un dude : 02-28-2012 at 08:00 PM.
Copy this message to clipboard
  #36  
Old 02-28-2012, 08:04 PM
Emperor_Nero's Avatar
Hero
$5 USD Donor New
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Referrals: 1
Posts: 6,767
 
Off Topic Participant Spam Forum Participant Community Participant GFX Forum Participant
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Quote:
Originally Posted by kmjt View Post
I suggest no double posting within 24 hours + no delete bumping. If new sellers don't like it well too bad any market is dog eat dog.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuF View Post
So we are making the market impossibly hard to use which in turn will drive new members away from our forums for what exactly?

Sounds like that is what they're suggesting. Making the market impossibly hard for new users. KMJT is pretty much suggesting everyone be damned if you don't already have enough customers to keep your thread permanently at the top. How is that fair?
__________________

Some can gaze and not be sick,
But I could never learn the trick.
There's this to say for blood and breath,
They give a man a taste for death.


Subnormal nonentity
Copy this message to clipboard
  #37  
Old 02-28-2012, 08:14 PM
kmjt's Avatar
-.- The nocturnal life chose me -.-
Cracker Head Retired Sectional Moderator kmjt Donor
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Check your mother's bed
Referrals: 8
Posts: 12,989
 
Extreme Homosex RsProd Pokémon Trainer OG Club <3 n4n0 Heidy
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Quote:
Originally Posted by just un dude View Post
How hard is it to read an msn adress? If you were hacked, you would be responsible for the losses from your customers anyway.
Also, guests who view your thread can't be added by imposters, they can't post their msn.. so that's out of the question.

And I'm sure your sythe account would be hacked or banned aswell, but whatever that's a different subject.
I preach for my customers to take safety precautions when making a transaction. Where have you been the past year when asking for confirmation is appropriate protocol? For all I know they are adding my imposters from my imposter list. If you can't be damned to give your customers a confirmation I suggest you get out of the market.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor_Nero View Post
Sounds like that is what they're suggesting. Making the market impossibly hard for new users. KMJT is pretty much suggesting everyone be damned if you don't already have enough customers to keep your thread permanently at the top. How is that fair?
Since when is a market supposed to be fair in society? You don't see McDonalds limited to X amount of television advertisements because the government wants local burger joints to succeed.

My suggestion isn't unfair at all and i'm sure thats how it was before. There was no problem then and I have no clue why it was ever changed. I started off with my suggested rule and it wasn't hard for me to rise when R2 and king were the only top dogs, i'm sure if new users are legitimate they won't have any problems either.
__________________
Copy this message to clipboard
  #38  
Old 02-28-2012, 08:16 PM
Arcus Isidar's Avatar
Whether you think you can, or think you can't, you're right.
Arcus Isidar Donor Sythe Verified User
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Referrals: 23
Posts: 4,113
 
Two Factor Authentication User Shitting Rainbow Extreme Homosex Sythe RSPS Player MushyMuncher Sythe Awards 2013 Winner Le Monkey
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Quote:
Originally Posted by just un dude View Post
How hard is it to read an msn adress? If you were hacked, you would be responsible for the losses from your customers anyway.
Also, guests who view your thread can't be added by imposters, they can't post their msn.. so that's out of the question.

And I'm sure your sythe account would be hacked or banned aswell, but whatever that's a different subject.
People without sythe accounts always ask me to post, it's not like the average person knows those logistics.
__________________



Copy this message to clipboard
  #39  
Old 02-28-2012, 08:16 PM
freakyhair's Avatar
Guru
$50 USD Donor New
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 1,294
Send a message via MSN to freakyhair Send a message via Skype™ to freakyhair
 
Default Re: Just to Clarify

What I dont get, is how it's an infractable offencewhen replying "Thanks, nice to do business with you" only a few minutes after the customer posted. The aim of that post is hardly trying to bring up the thread in the forums, since it was only a few minutes since the last post, so it will already be up high..
Copy this message to clipboard
  #40  
Old 02-28-2012, 08:17 PM
Hero
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Netherlands
Referrals: 5
Posts: 5,329
Send a message via MSN to just un dude Send a message via Skype™ to just un dude
 
Default Re: Just to Clarify

Quote:
Originally Posted by freakyhair View Post
What I dont get, is how it's an infractable offencewhen replying "Thanks, nice to do business with you" only a few minutes after the customer posted. The aim of that post is hardly trying to bring up the thread in the forums, since it was only a few minutes since the last post, so it will already be up high..
I'm sure no one will mind if you do it a minute after the customer does.

This wasn't the case though, there were hours inbetween.

Last edited by just un dude : 02-28-2012 at 08:17 PM.
Copy this message to clipboard
 



 wow gold

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

All times are GMT +1. The time now is 02:17 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.1